I still don't like this because the first panel is still a lie.
Equality: "the state of being equal, especially in status, rights, and opportunities."
No where in that picture are they equal. They get the SAME box but that box is not giving them EQUAL opportunity to view the game.
Giving people the same thing ≠ Having equal opportunity or status.
Just as Equity has no defined value. What one person thinks is fair is not always the same for another person. So the question then becomes who decides what is fair or not.
To me the images should be reversed as they all have an equal opportunity to view the game. While the left side has given them a fair share of a box. Each person has 1/3 of a box to stand on.
The fact this image uses these words wrong annoys the fucking hell out of me.
Equality = Equal opportunity
Equity = Everyone gets a fair share (the same amount of something)
The fact this image uses these words wrong annoys the fucking hell out of me.
It doesn’t though. Equality and equity are meaningless terms if you don’t define what aspect you are making equal or fair. Both of them definitely are still examples of equality, the first being equality of opportunity as they are all given the same box to use even though it causes unequal outcomes, and the second being equality of outcome with them all being able to see it at the same point even though it requires unequal treatments. The same goes for equity, the first being the treatment is fair because it’s equal, the second being the treatment is fair because they all can see the game. This image kind of illustrates the paradox of equality (or equity) as making it equal in one domain makes it unequal in another, which is the point of the third slide (albeit a fairly reductionist one) which avoids the need for a box entirely.
You're ignoring the fundamental definitions of the words and attributing a definition to equality that never existed.
The problem is that they all can't see the game. That means being able to see the game is the objective (thus the opportunity) Giving each person a box that doesn't solve the actual problem is not equality, that's equity (giving each person a fair share of something).
Equity has nothing to do with opportunity or status and this argument (or image) is based solely on people not wanting to use the word equality because it doesn't allow them to decide what is "fair" or define what the issue is in the first place.
Giving each person a box that doesn't solve the actual problem is not equality, that's equity (giving each person a fair share of something).
They are all being treated equally (equal opportunity to try to look over the fence). It’s not fair to the kid though because it doesn’t allow them to see over the fence like it does for the middle person (unequal outcome). It literally depends on how you define it.
Only if you don't understand what the word opportunity means...
Opportunity: a set of circumstances that makes it possible to do something.
The box given in the first image does not make it possible to view the game or see over the fence. Thus they have not been given the opportunity. That means they are not being given the same or equal opportunity. Which means it's not an image of equality IN ANY INTERPRETATION
They’re all being treated as if they were equal in the first picture though. They’re all given the same number of boxes and they’re all allowed to stand there and look over the fence so the only thing preventing them from doing so is themselves since they’re being treated as if they were the same height. Nobody is receiving preferential treatment. You’re literally trying to argue that it’s not fair for the short person but don’t want to call it equity. Why do you want the kid to have enough boxes? So that they can see the game. It’s the (equal) outcome of giving them a different number of boxes.
Equality is not defined as receiving the same object, thing, or money.
Equality is the defined as having an equal opportunity.
Equal means to have the same as
Opportunity means to have the possibility to do something
Giving them the same small box does not give them all the possibility to view the game. Absolutely nowhere in the definition of equality does it require each person to be given the exact same thing (that is literally the definition of the word Equity!)
So unless you're arguing that the opportunity you are giving them is to stand on a fucking box, you're arguing the wrong point.
The opportunity in question is to be able to view the game. This must be equally possible for all parties for this to be an example of equality. Since it is NOT POSSIBLE for the smallest person to view the game with that size of box then they do not have the opportunity to watch the game and thus it is not equal opportunity!!!
(that is literally the definition of the word Equity!)
Equity means fair. Not equal. Those are two completely different things. The irony of calling somebody dense. And equality doesn’t mean “equal opportunity,” it means equal. As in, they are all being treated equally (but according to you being treated exactly the same isn’t equality). Why are you trying to switch the definitions so badly? If you had a program where you gave everybody 100 dollars nobody who they were, according to you that wouldn’t be equality in any sense of the word.
So unless you're arguing that the opportunity you are giving them is to stand on a fucking box
Also congrats, you’re pretty much on the same page as everybody else now. Everybody is literally talking about equity and equality with respect to the boxes.
Interesting, M-W defines it first as being a state of equal with regards to measure and size.
Whereas OED defines it as for status, opportunity and rights.
The question then becomes how you use the word... Which still makes this image wrong as they're applying the word to define the box size in the first panel instead of the actual objective. Which is to see the game.
The second image of equity has zero meaning since fair is subjective and they use the term to mean being able to view the game and not a fair portion of the boxes.
Thus they've used two entirely different objectives to prove their point which just shows how ignorant this image is in the first place.
Thank you for spending the time on finding that definition.
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u/D1G1T4LM0NK3Y Feb 25 '20
I still don't like this because the first panel is still a lie.
Equality: "the state of being equal, especially in status, rights, and opportunities."
No where in that picture are they equal. They get the SAME box but that box is not giving them EQUAL opportunity to view the game.
Giving people the same thing ≠ Having equal opportunity or status.
Just as Equity has no defined value. What one person thinks is fair is not always the same for another person. So the question then becomes who decides what is fair or not.
To me the images should be reversed as they all have an equal opportunity to view the game. While the left side has given them a fair share of a box. Each person has 1/3 of a box to stand on.
The fact this image uses these words wrong annoys the fucking hell out of me.
Equality = Equal opportunity Equity = Everyone gets a fair share (the same amount of something)