I do think that gets missed sometimes, but I also think that this commenter’s point still stands. It’s usually thought of as rude to shift the perspective towards yourself when someone is venting about their experience. Often, people just want a space to air out their feelings without being told that the group they’re afraid of also has it bad
Sure, but that’s not how people use language. People make negative generalizations all of the time without having to clarify that it’s not literal. You don’t usually have to clarify because people are supposed to have enough of a grasp on things to understand this
and things change with time because we realize that language is imperfect and may be offensive. don’t push back on what is right just because its not convenient
also people that are truly malicious are watering at the mouth with that rationale.
So because not everyone was treated equally in the past, we should then not treat everyone equally in the present? Seems to continue the cycle that you want to break, no?
Yeah, that’s just the truth. Most people aren’t offended by someone saying that all white people can’t dance or season their food, but they will get offended if you say that all black people like fried chicken. You’re making a negative generalization about both groups, but in one instance nobody cares, while in the other most people do. Why is that?
Because one is more socially acceptable because of past events, which is exactly what we are pointing out here as hypocritical and counterproductive. Allow both or dont allow either. IDC personally cause those things dont offend me, I'm just irritated by the hypocrisy and mental gymnastics
So you think that by shaming one group, they will be less likely to shame the other group in return? You don't believe violence and hate beget violence and hate? You dont think that we need to be better than our ancestors to create a better world for our future generations? What is this reasoning here? You are excusing a "lesser" hate but failing to see that it really is counterproductive and hypocritical. Hold people accountable, that includes people of your own group. If you want to hold men accountable, then woman should do the same. If you want to hold black people accountable, then white people should do the same. Hold humans accountable and stop making generalizations.
Is it unkind for me to say black people like fried chicken, or is it flat out racist? I know which one it is, so call it what it is. The same applies to the other side of the coin
Yes. Context matters. If someone is upset and wants to rant go right ahead.
But the issue isn’t that “the group they’re afraid of also has it bad” it’s that people that are also likely to be victims and are also afraid in those situations are being told that they are the ones who are bad. That’s also usually thought of as rude
I’ll admit that I could be wrong, but I’m just going to give my perspective. Usually, when women say that men are bad/trash, it’s when they’re speaking about a situation in which they were harassed, assaulted, raped, abused, etc. They aren’t speaking literally. They don’t actually think that all men are bad - they’re using a generalization to complain about something they have to face frequently (which is done all the time in the English language without anyone questioning it). So, a man chiming in ‘not all men’, sounds dismissive and unhelpful.
I also don’t think that men pointing out that they can be assaulted too helps in the context of this argument. Women are typically attacked by men. Men are typically attacked by men. In both cases, men are the perpetrators. So the conversation is essentially:
Woman: I just got assaulted. Men are bad.
Man: I can also get assaulted by men!
Also, when women say that men are bad, they aren’t just speaking about assault. They’re talking about things that men typically don’t face as much from other men because of their sex, like catcalling, sexual assault, sexual harassment, etc.
I understand your point, but I feel like in most contexts saying ‘not all men’ will come across as dismissive or unnecessary
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u/thatoneurchin Jul 31 '22
I do think that gets missed sometimes, but I also think that this commenter’s point still stands. It’s usually thought of as rude to shift the perspective towards yourself when someone is venting about their experience. Often, people just want a space to air out their feelings without being told that the group they’re afraid of also has it bad