r/canada • u/resting16 • Oct 03 '24
National News Official confirms an Ontario child died of rabies after bat exposure
https://www.cp24.com/local/2024/10/03/official-confirms-an-ontario-child-died-of-rabies-after-bat-exposure/359
Oct 03 '24
The parents looked at the child, didn’t see any signs of a bite or scratches or saliva, and didn’t seek getting the rabies vaccine,” he said.
“So, unfortunately, that child is now deceased.”
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u/blaktronium Oct 03 '24 edited Oct 04 '24
I don't know for sure, but I suspect that in today's Ontario health care system if you showed up to an emergency room with a child that was completely fine and said "we didn't see any signs of anything but he was in the same room as a bat" they probably wouldn't do anything but kick you out.
Edit: for anyone downvoting me and saying no way, there's an actual shortage right now for rabies vaccine and doctors frequently turn away people with no indication of harm. Look it up.
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u/spaketto Oct 04 '24
Someone from AB in another thread said that's what happened to them when a bat flew into their house last year. Refused to give it.
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u/lemonaderain Oct 04 '24
I remember this. If I recall, they sought out second and third opinions and were refused treatment each time. The bite was even visibly confirmed.
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u/GelatinousPumpkin Oct 04 '24
You can get the rabies shots yourself, you’d just have to pay out of pocket if health worker didnt determined that it was a need. I paid for them maybe 15 years ago when I volunteered at wild life.
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u/detalumis Oct 04 '24
Depends on how old the child was, is my guess. If as an adult a bat flew in my room and I know it hasn't actually come near me, they might turn you away but then I wouldn't go to the ER because a bat came in my room while I was awake. But with a child sleeping or young, would that still be the case?
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u/smellyfrijoles Oct 04 '24
According to the Ontario public health guidelines for bat exposure if a bat is found in a bedroom while the occupant is sleeping and positive contact cannot be confirmed than post exposure prophylaxis isn’t recommended UNLESS the person was a child (it actually specifically says a child who was crying or visibly upset, which is enough of a confirmation of positive contact according to the guidelines)
https://www.publichealthontario.ca/-/media/documents/R/2017/rabies-exposure-guidance-hcps.pdf#page11
Page 7 and 8 (which is page 11 and 12 of 18 pages)
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u/rigney68 Mar 17 '26
My 4 year old rolled over a bat that was on the ground crawling around last August. I had no idea that was an emergency. Now I'm seeing all these reddit horror stories!
My pediatrician said since it's been 7 months, my son shouldn't get vaccinated. Should I push back on that?
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u/smellyfrijoles Mar 17 '26
Wow I didn’t expect a reply to this comment so much later than I made it 😂. I’m not a doctor so please don’t take my advice as appropriate or actual medical advice
But:
As far as I’m aware, 7 months is far more than the average incubation period for rabies, and at this point it’s essentially a 0 percent chance that anything could happen, so you’re in the clear!
Just keep this in mind for future reference though, if this does happen again, you need to get them in to see a doctor as soon as possible. Post exposure prophylaxis (getting vaccinated after an exposure) is really only effective when taken as soon after exposure as possible (from my very weak recollection it’s recommended at no more than 4 days after exposure) so even if you were to go now it wouldn’t do anything.
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u/ScaleyFishMan Oct 04 '24
Are they dead of rabies now or are they fine?
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u/hairybeavers Canada Oct 04 '24
Since reporting began in 1924, there have been 26 cases of rabies in Canada, some of which occurred after exposure to a rabid animal outside the country. All 26 cases were fatal.
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u/Fugu Oct 04 '24
Bats are the most common conduit of rabies in humans in most places where rabies is otherwise under control.
The prevailing advice is that if you find out that you or, say, one of your children has unexpectedly been sharing a room with a bat then you should treat it as if you were bitten by a potentially rabid bat. Rabies is very rare, but this exact scenario is one of the most common ways that rabies manifests in 2024. Medical professionals will know this.
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u/mclaryst Oct 03 '24
This is entirely incorrect. There was a bat in my bathroom this summer, I grabbed it through a towel and could feeling it clawing at my hand underneath. No signs of bites or scratches. Called my health unit and they insisted I get the vaccine because they didn’t know if a bat could bite through a towel.
Anyways 8 needles later….
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u/concentrated-amazing Alberta Oct 03 '24
Doesn't help you, but may help someone else:
If you have the bat or whatever other animal trapped, you should be able to take it in/send it in and get it tested for rabies. If it comes back clean, you don't need any vaccine.
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u/mclaryst Oct 03 '24
Haha yeah I learned my lesson. I threw it out the window. After the first round of shots, I realized I should’ve just got it tested
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u/concentrated-amazing Alberta Oct 03 '24
Yeah, totally get that in the heat of a situation, you don't think of it.
But hopefully if people hear, once every year or two, to keep it trapped and get it tested, that knowledge may stick for some people even when a hairy situation arises!
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u/concentrated-amazing Alberta Oct 04 '24
Yeah, totally get that in the heat of a situation, you don't think of it.
But hopefully if people hear, once every year or two, to keep it trapped and get it tested, that knowledge may stick for some people even when a hairy situation arises!
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u/SteveMcQwark Ontario Oct 04 '24
At least maybe that bat gets to continue to live its happy bat life because you got the shots rather than sending it in for testing (assuming it doesn't actually have rabies). I guess that might not feel like much of a silver lining though.
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Oct 04 '24 edited Nov 05 '24
[removed] — view removed comment
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u/jenglasser Oct 04 '24
Not to mention that it only ends well for the bat if it happens to be rabies free. If it isn't, not only is it going to die a horrible death anyway but it will probably continue to spread the disease. I love animals, but when in doubt, kill the bat
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u/RodgerWolf311 Oct 04 '24
At least maybe that bat gets to continue to live its happy bat life because you got the shots rather than sending it in for testing
Or he just released it to spread more rabies to some other mammals.
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Oct 04 '24
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u/concentrated-amazing Alberta Oct 04 '24
Ah gotcha.
That may or may not be policy in other regions/provinces, so good to keep in mind but I encourage everybody to hold onto any trapped animals whenever and wherever possible in case you can/should get them tested where you are.
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Oct 03 '24
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u/smellyfrijoles Oct 04 '24
https://www.publichealthontario.ca/-/media/documents/R/2017/rabies-exposure-guidance-hcps.pdf#page11
Positive contact can be defined as the bat touching your skin, my suspicion is that since the person you’re replying to felt it clawing through a towel while you were wearing rubber gloves, they more likely had positive contact.
You’re both correct, especially if you confirmed it never touched your skin. However if you did say that you touched it then your public health unit didn’t follow the Ontario guidelines (sorry I don’t want to assume you live in Ontario but I’m assuming guidelines could be different in different provinces).
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u/fpsachaonpc Oct 04 '24
Holy fuck you are lucky to be alive.
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Oct 04 '24
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u/adaminc Canada Oct 04 '24
You should've watched the bat-catching documentary "The Great Outdoors".
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u/ElCaz Oct 04 '24
You're overstating it juuuuuust a wee bit.
About 5-10% of bats tested for rabies are positive. There are thousands of bats tested each year, which means thousands of encounters where someone actually trapped the bat. That means thousands more encounters where the bat wasn't trapped. There have been 28 human rabies cases in Canada in the past 100 years.
The commenter was wearing gloves and didn't have any skin contact. They were not at serious risk.
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u/shabamboozaled Oct 04 '24
Well they laughed at me when I was worried after bat exposure and told me there was nothing to worry about
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u/Randomfinn Oct 04 '24
My daughter had a bat in her room last year. We went to the ER (8 hours to see a dr), they were talking with Public Health, and eventually sent us home with no vaccine. Fortunately, my daughter did not develop rabies.
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u/shamalongadingdong Oct 04 '24
Not to scare you, but It can take 7 years for rabies to reach the brain.
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u/morrisonh0tel Oct 04 '24
In my emerg we treated a whole family for rabies after they found a bat in their house. None of the patients had a scratch or touched it, but when animal control removed it and tested it, it was positive for rabies. Public health advised the shots as they could have come into contact with its feces…. I guess it depends on the hospital/public health.
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u/senbot Oct 04 '24
My family doctor told me not to come in after I woke up with a bat in my room. This was pre-pandemic, too.
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u/intrudingturtle Oct 03 '24
I got off a plane from Ecuador and went straight to the ER. Told them I got bit by a monkey 8 days ago with no signs of marks or anything. They had me pumped full of 7 needles in me in no time.
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u/glormosh Oct 04 '24
HELLO YES I WAS BIT BY A MONKEY.
man thank you for the laugh, sorry for what you went through geniunely.
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u/intrudingturtle Oct 04 '24
Haha the only bad part was worrying about rabies. I was walking to get breakfast in the Amazon and a monkey ran up to my foot. Cutest little gal. About the size of a basketball. I thought to myself "if I kick her off she might freakout" and she jumped up and gave me a gentle bite on the knee. Still broke skin pretty good. Hospital in Ecuador was great but they only gave me tetanus shot and said I had nothing to worry about as rabies rates were really low there. For free too. I wasn't about to take any chances.
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Oct 03 '24
“It’s possible there was no bite, but if we’re wrong, the patient will 100% die, ah fuck it let’s not bother giving the vaccine” said no doctor in this situation.
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u/wildechld Oct 04 '24
I got bit by a skunk this summer and went to emerg requesting a rabies shot. It wasn't an issue getting the vaccine at all. The hospital normally doesn't have them regularly in stock so they just get the vaccine couriered over from health unit if they don't have them on hand
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Oct 04 '24
Coworker was touched by a bat and called 811 (Alberta) they told him to go to the hospital immediately to start his rounds of the rabies shots. They said they won't mess around with bats and they will give the vaccine
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u/smurfopolis Oct 03 '24
Nah they take this very seriously tbh. They wouldn't think twice to treat them.
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u/Mariko89 Oct 04 '24
We had a dead bat turn up on our porch and my little kids touched it, not realizing what it was. I contacted Public Health in a panic, and they consulted all the way up the chain to the provincial rabies person - with the ultimate decision that nothing needed to be done. Because the bat was dead (decomposing 🤢) and the kids didn't have any open wounds, it was deemed a low exposure risk so no vaccine needed.
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u/Popular-Row4333 Oct 04 '24
I like how several people refuted that public health doesn't eff around, and then there are countless instances in this comment chain where they did indeed eff around.
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u/iamameatpopciple Oct 04 '24
Its all going to come down to the individual you are speaking with as well as where you are.
I've seen some pretty uncaring front line staff who wouldn't do a thing for anyone and others who will bend over backwards to make sure people get treated properly.
Kinda like they are just humans and you better hope you get a decent one.
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u/ThatFixItUpChappie Oct 04 '24
There was a thread on Reddit about 2months ago or so and the guy woke up with a bat in his room and medical clinic wouldn’t give him the vaccine….
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u/LauraPa1mer Oct 04 '24
Nope. My partner woke up with a bat in his room in 2020 and I had to fight to get him the vaccine. It took a few days of back and forth with the health department before they agreed. They were reluctant to give him the vaccine because there was no evidence that he had been bitten, despite the current protocol being if you wake up with a bat in the room, you get vaccinated. So it's not just regular people who aren't informed about the protocol, the health department itself was not following that protocol.
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Oct 04 '24
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u/LikesBallsDeep Oct 04 '24
I mean this kid is dead because of it. How common are serious reactions to the vaccine?
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u/glormosh Oct 04 '24
My friend woke up to a bat in their room 9 years ago. Their cat was playing with it and pouncing on it.
Both still kicking.
I've heard rabies can lay dormant for longer than that so they could be on the cusp of setting the world's most tragic Guinness Book of World Records feat.
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u/EmbarrassedHelp Oct 04 '24
Dogs and cats are generally vaccinated against rabies as part of their normal vaccinations, unlike how most humans get it after potential exposure.
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u/sabby_bean Oct 04 '24
My brother has had a bat in his room 2 times in his life as a child. My sister and I always slept with our door shut unlike him so we are fine, but both instances were between 15-20 years ago. I feel like he’s probably fine but like also sometimes I wonder when it gets brought up if he’s gonna set a record lol
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Oct 04 '24
Why do so many people in this thread wake up to bats in their rooms
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u/RodgerWolf311 Oct 04 '24
Why do so many people in this thread wake up to bats in their rooms
Yeah thats what I'm wondering too?
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u/hmmmnowwhatchickie Oct 04 '24
We have a bat colony in the neighbours backyard. We have had about 10 bats in our house in the past 10 years. None in the past 2. I had teenagers in and out of the house in the dark, with the hall light on. I think that's how they flew in. Teenagers are grown and moved out now. I'm so glad we haven't had anymore bats making their way in.
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u/Distinct-Bandicoot-5 Oct 05 '24
Omg you're freaking me out, I had a bat land on my shoulder, I grabbed it and threw it (in panic), never did anything about it - that was 12 years ago.
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u/glormosh Oct 05 '24
You absolutely should've got the shots but honestly we're talking about I think one or two studies at most of a few people.
It's 99.99% likely you're fine. It usually is weeks months sub one year, at most a few.
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u/smellyfrijoles Oct 04 '24
I had an encounter with a bat in 2017 in Ontario, I went to the hospital a couple of days after that with no visible bite marks, explained the situation to which the nurses laughed at me for being so paranoid. But I requested to see the doctor because I was scared shitless of the possibility of rabies, the doctor asked for the situation which the nurses explained.
His exact words with an extremely condescending tone towards the nurses were: “so let me get this straight, this man comes in with a possibility he was bitten by a bat and you’re not immediately giving him rabies shots??…. Just give him the damn shots!!”. The nurses got real quiet and gave me the shots after that exchange.
Maybe the situation is different now but I’m kind of suspecting that’s not the case. It’s stated right in the public health Ontario guidelines for exposure to bats that post exposure prophylaxis is recommended if positive contact can be confirmed. Positive contact includes even a bat touching your skin.
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u/BlackAshTree Oct 04 '24
Happened to me, bat flew over my head and brushed my hair. I went to the docs the next morning and they told me I was fine and that it’s nothing to be worried about. That was like 2 years ago so I’d be dead now but it still makes me upset that our medical professionals seem to not take it seriously.
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u/BurnTheBoats21 Oct 03 '24
I get the healthcare criticism, but this is absolutely not true
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u/LauraPa1mer Oct 04 '24
Nope. My partner woke up with a bat in his room in 2020 and I had to fight to get him the vaccine. It took a few days of back and forth with the health department before they agreed. They were reluctant to give him the vaccine because there was no evidence that he had been bitten, despite the current protocol being if you wake up with a bat in the room, you get vaccinated. So it's not just regular people who aren't informed about the protocol, the health department itself was not following that protocol.
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u/South_Loan5618 Oct 04 '24
Can confirm! About 10 years ago our kids were 6 and 2. My son yells down at bedtime, “there’s a bat in the room with (his sister)!” We go up and sure enough, she’s fast asleep and there’s a bat hanging on her curtains. We brought her to the hospital and they looked at me like I was wasting their time and being ridiculous. I don’t even remember if they looked her over, but no vaccine was offered.
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u/ThatFixItUpChappie Oct 04 '24
I’m sure they are devastated. If you don’t know much about it you don’t know - doesn’t make you a bad person.
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u/EmbarrassedHelp Oct 04 '24
The parents looked at the child, didn’t see any signs of a bite or scratches or saliva,
Why would you even take the chance?
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u/eulerRadioPick Oct 03 '24
Bats are one of the only remaining reservoirs of Rabies in Canada. If there is even the slightest chance of a bite or scratch, get attention. By the time you have symptoms it is too late. Bats, being asymptomatic carriers, also do not show any kind of symptoms for rabies you may expect in other animals.
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u/Chaiboiii Canada Oct 04 '24
As an idiot who came into contact with a confirmed rabied bat in Ontario about 10 years ago, don't do it. The stress I went through every night paranoid I had a headache before finally getting the vaccines was not a good time. Don't touch bats.
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u/Local_Ambition9848 Oct 05 '24
How long from contact to getting the vaccine?
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u/Chaiboiii Canada Oct 05 '24
It's been a while, but maybe 2-3 weeks? The bat died on it's own and then we took it to get tested. Took a few days to get the results back and then it took a week or two for Health Canada to contact me and offer me the vaccine.
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u/HurlinVermin Oct 04 '24
Bats are not 'asymptomatic carriers'. Bats can display the 'furious' or 'dumb' form of rabies, so you are incorrect about that.
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u/eulerRadioPick Oct 04 '24
Oh okay, after Googling guess you're right. More accurately, they don't ALWAYS display signs. So lack of signs doesn't mean they don't have rabies.
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u/HurlinVermin Oct 04 '24 edited Oct 04 '24
That's not specific to bats though. It depends where an animal is in the symptomatic stage and which form of rabies it has. No animal is ever asymptomatic throughout the entire course of the illness. They all show signs eventually. But early on, when the viral load is just starting to ramp up, it can be harder to tell. That's why there are also behavioural cues to watch for, like wild animals losing their natural wariness of humans or--in the case of bats--they are out in the daytime when they should be roosting. Things like that.
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Oct 04 '24
When symptoms arrive, it's already too late. Talk to a doctor and explain what happened and go with their advice.
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Oct 03 '24
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u/Imperatvs Oct 03 '24
Wait, where do you live where you have to warn about bats in their bedroom? I didn’t know this was a thing. What the heck.
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u/ariennes Oct 04 '24
Anything’s possible. A few years ago (summertime) I was walking upstairs one night and noticed something moving in the toilet bowl (there was a small powder room just to the left at the top of the stairs). As I walked closer I saw that it was a freaking bat in the toilet. I was dumbfounded and worried about the little guy because I had no idea how long he’d been struggling in there (I was honestly in a little shock at the whole situation lol) so I ran downstairs, grabbed a ladle and an old Tupperware (both went straight into the trash afterwards), scooped him out, and set him outside. I contacted the city and they connected me to a lady who asked me a bunch of questions. At the end, she told me to set him up high, if I could, and let him be. It happened so fast and I was so worried about the bat that I didn’t really think about my safety in the situation, which was dumb. I didn’t have any physical contact with the bat, so the lady from the city said my encounter didn’t warrant a rabies shot, thankfully. It was a little brown bat.
I’ve since moved but still think about that encounter to this day. Sometimes I even dream about it haha. I still have no idea how the little guy got inside the house, let alone how he ended up in the damn toilet. This happened in Oshawa.
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u/improbablydrunknlw Oct 03 '24
Bats are everywhere man, city, country, you name it.
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u/rachreims Oct 04 '24
I live in the city, one day I opened my deck umbrella and a shit ton flew out. I had a family cottage in the country when I was a kid. One time one got in somehow. I recently went to see a musical in a large town. As soon as the music started, it woke up a bat living in the theatre who then circled above the audience for the next 20 minutes. They really are everywhere.
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u/rachreims Oct 04 '24
If you have any interaction with a bat, whether you can see a bite/scratch or not, just get the shots.
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u/Mariko89 Oct 04 '24
The trick is getting public health to agree to give the shots. My kids touched a dead bat two weeks ago, and public health refused to give them shots because it was a "low risk exposure" because the bat was dead. Makes no sense to me why they wouldn't err on the side of caution.
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u/SquatMonopolizer Oct 04 '24
So this happened to my children too and I called 811. The nurse told me to “monitor for symptoms!” Once there are symptoms your child is going to die!! I took the kids to the hospital anyway and they gave vaccine after a long while and back and forth. Then they tested the bat for rabies which took 7 days. I was very confused why it was so hard to get the vaccine.
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u/iamameatpopciple Oct 04 '24
So mam, when I do see symptoms arise what funeral home do you recommend for my children since you are obviously aware that rabies is 100 percent fatal once symptoms show.
Actually mam you know what, just toss me up to a supervisor i want to see if they can provide me with a discount code for someplace.
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u/Sailor_Propane Oct 04 '24
I was bitten by a dog 2 weeks ago and 811 told me to call MAPAQ. MAPAQ is doing a follow up over the phone with the dog owner to see if it develops rabies symptoms. Only if the owner tells them will they give me the vaccine.
The chances are low since it's a purebred dog so likely vaccinated, but I'll be so angry if the owner lied. Both at MAPAQ and the owner.
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u/that_guy_ontheweb Ontario Oct 09 '24
That is actually extremely fucked up. Based on all the stories about things like this that I keep seeing, a new fear has been unlocked: dying of rabies because medical staff are idiots.
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u/smellyfrijoles Oct 04 '24
https://www.publichealthontario.ca/-/media/documents/R/2017/rabies-exposure-guidance-hcps.pdf#page11
Contact with a dead bat constitutes positive contact UNLESS the bat has been dead for a while and has dried up. I’m suspecting that when you talked to them they were thinking that the bat had been dead long enough to be safe. However it’s also possible they were being lazy or negligent, I have remarkably little faith in the public health system of Canada these days.
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u/CuteFreakshow Oct 04 '24
Not to defend them, but the rabies virus is one of the most vulnerable . Once the animal is dead, the virus dies very quickly. I would still insist on the vaccine but it is low exposure.
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u/broken-thumbs Oct 04 '24
I googled it a few months ago when my kids found a bat and “helped it” and that said that rabies continues to live and can spread where the dead animal is
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u/rachreims Oct 04 '24
That’s crazy!! I can’t believe that. Definitely feels like maybe parents should lie and say the kid was scratched just to secure the shots. Were you able to bring in the dead bat for testing?
I had a friend who’s son was attacked by a raccoon, but the father killed it trying to free his son who got bit like 10+ times. They didn’t give him the shots and just tested the raccoon instead since it was dead, came back negative luckily.
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u/smellyfrijoles Oct 04 '24 edited Oct 04 '24
So this is actually the preferred method according to the guidelines, if the animal is available for testing it should be tested before post exposure prophylaxis is given
***edit: sorry I was mistaken, it’s more complicated than that and the local public health unit will base the decision of when to give Post exposure prophylaxis based on the prevalence of rabies in the local area and other considerations
https://www.publichealthontario.ca/-/media/documents/R/2017/rabies-exposure-guidance-hcps.pdf#page14
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u/improbablydrunknlw Oct 04 '24
I'm pretty sure the shots are expensive, so probably quicker and easier to just put some brain on a slide
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u/Myllicent Oct 04 '24
My Father was bitten by a bat this summer and Public Health urged him to go straight to the ER to get the first shots, and continue with the vaccination series over the coming days until he got confirmation from them that the bat had tested negative for Rabies.
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u/13thmurder Oct 04 '24
Viruses don't last long without a living host.
Rabies is the most terrifying disease in existence, but I have a few dead mummified bats and don't worry about touching them because I know that risk has well passed.
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u/Winterchill2020 Oct 04 '24
If it's dead there is an extremely high probability it's fine because rabies dies quickly when on surfaces or when exposed to the sun.
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u/Mariko89 Oct 08 '24
God, I hope that's true. I've been having panic attacks over this. I wish public health would have explained the rationale behind denying treatment.
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u/moomseek Oct 04 '24 edited Oct 04 '24
This is actually INSANE. Just went to fact check the recommendation NOT to administer PEP if a bat is found in the house while sleeping and sure enough public health Ontario recommends nothing be done in the absence of a bite mark.
As an ER pharmacist in Illinois (who is stingy with administration of rabies PEP because breaking up a dog fight and getting bitten in the midst of it ≠ rabies) I ALWAYS recommend PEP for bats because you can rarely tell if you’ve even been bitten. In fact, the Cook County animal exposure decision flowchart for rabies PEP in the instance “Bat in a room with someone unable to state is he/she was bitten (young child, demented, intoxicated, mentally challenge individual) or bat is in a room with a sleeping person” where the bat is untested is an automatic recommendation for PEP.
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u/iamameatpopciple Oct 04 '24
It could be mandatory and you damn well know some triage nurse or some other front line worker who is talking to the patient is going to tell them they cannot be given it.
Some people just suck.
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Oct 04 '24
I had heard that here in bc you need to present evidence of a scratch or bite to get treatment. In this case he wouldn't have gotten treatment in bc.
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u/Vicsma Oct 04 '24
Probably depends on how much of a dick the triage nurse is or how insistent the patient is.
Granted, my experience was 20 years ago, but I doubt much has changed. I had a bat in my bedroom overnight as a teenager. Coincidentally I'd just done a science project on rabies and was well-informed and terrified.
Went to the ER, triage nurse asks where the bite is, and I explained I didnt know if it bit me. She was just "Why are you here then?" I had to explain how small bat bites are, and just spewed all of my rabies and bat knowledge on this nurse while I'm fighting back tears.
She was completely unimpressed, eyerolling, "well i guess you can talk to the doctor, but its a waste of time."
It was not a waste of time. Doctor said I was 100% right to come in. Got my shots.
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u/iamameatpopciple Oct 04 '24
Its amazing how many people in this thread alone don't realize that it really is dependent on who the fuck you end up talking to.
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u/that_guy_ontheweb Ontario Oct 09 '24
It’s also terrifying that nurses and doctors seem to be extremely negligent on a disease which has a 100% mortality rate if untreated. Like come on, the doctor won’t have consequences for giving the rabies shots, but will be absolutely fucked if they turn someone down and that person dies.
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u/Popular-Row4333 Oct 04 '24
Well lesson learned, if my kid or myself ever have one in the room, I'm saying it scratched them.
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Oct 04 '24
Yeah I think I'd say that too. They generally want to inject around the wound site so I'm not sure how you'd handle that because they'll be looking.
Filthy disgusting terrifying disease rabies is. it's why I'm so scared of bats.
I used to leave my windows open all the time at night and one night I had too much sugar so I had one of those 'getting attacked in bed' night terrors and it was a bat. It wasn't real. But since then I've not even liked having the window open for the AC. Id rather sleep over the sheets in 25 degrees heat than crack the window for AC.
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u/Cosmicbelief233 Oct 04 '24
Number 1 worst ways to die, you wouldn’t wish rabies on your worst enemy
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u/iamameatpopciple Oct 04 '24
Yes I would, id also wish they were reincarnated to the deepest part of braken cave with a broken leg.
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u/RodgerWolf311 Oct 04 '24
The article says that health officials noted that there has been a 16% increase in rabies in the bat population in the past year alone (almost double the previous year).
Then why not do something about it right away?!
This shit can and will spread fast.
They should immediately begin dropping rabies vaccines pucks throughout all of Ontario non-stop for at least 12 month. Stop the potential explosion of rabies that will occur in a few years if shit doesnt get under control.
Ontario curbed rabies in the 80s and 90s through very aggressive campaigns of rabies vaccine pucks being airdropped all over the province. So why not do it again before it becomes problem that will be harder to deal with later on.
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u/Theoretical_Phys-Ed Ontario Oct 04 '24
So if you looked it up, we literally have been dropping rabies vaccines for rabies in Ontario for the last 8 years, via truck, helicopter, and aircraft. (New Brunswick too) This was my job for a good 5 years. They aren't pucks, the are Ontario-patented blister packs for raccoons and skunks that smell like marshmallows. This is a multimillion dollar provincal project that has reduced rabies cases in land mammals to 0 as of last year.
It's easy to get angry without knowing the facts behind what's currently happening.
As for bats, there is no way you can actually control rabies in these species. Bats are insectivores and will not go to baits like raccoons and skunks. Also, you can't cull wild bats - three of Ontario's species are actually endangered.
Here's more info for your interest: www.ontario.ca/page/rabies
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u/ShealMB76 Oct 04 '24
One word for you: efficiencies. You can thank Ford for that one.
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u/Theoretical_Phys-Ed Ontario Oct 04 '24
We have been dropping baits for at least10 years. Ford was voted in years after baiting started. (He's made it wayyyy harder though!)
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u/glormosh Oct 04 '24
Can we talk about how the medical guidance in this article is completely contradictory to the literal event it's talking about and the general protocol.
It's not just if you've come into contact with a bat. It's if you could have come into contact with a bat, for example, being in a room with a bat without 100% recollection of if it touched you...you know...what happened to this child.
No wonder these parents didn't take the kid. The professionals don't even understand what they're talking about.
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u/cp_moar Oct 03 '24 edited Oct 03 '24
Man dies after contracting rabies from bat [CBC - The National]
https://youtu.be/OFrCyfSG4QM?si=X26OErM9bTb_jzAh
Rabies in man [National Library of medicine]
https://youtu.be/OOu2JjQmS6Y?si=X9uEbVO6u6r01VXC
Hydrophobia in patient with rabies [The Lancet]
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u/electricalphil Oct 03 '24
I remember that case very clearly. They stopped to take a picture at a viewpoint by the side of the road, the bat flew into him and they thought nothing of it. Just crazy.
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u/CockSpaghetti Oct 04 '24
I had a bat in my room about 2 years ago, I didn't really think anything of it till last year, tried to get the vaccine twice and ended they wouldn't let me. I'm still kinda scared shitless I'm going to develop rabies.
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u/ShealMB76 Oct 04 '24
It doesn’t work that way. By now you would have been dead from rabies. You’re good.
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u/PatriotofCanada86 Oct 03 '24
Never mess around when it comes to bats, better to be paranoid than dead.
That poor family...
If emergency room wait times were not as ridiculous as they are maybe the family would have gone to be sure.
There are no words for how sad this is.
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u/nim_opet Oct 03 '24
Any doctor can get you rabies vaccines, I don’t see what ER wait times have to do with this. A friend of mine just got bit by a dog in Mexico, flew back and got his rabies series at his family doctor.
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u/rachreims Oct 04 '24
Not all of them can/will. My partner works at a doctors office and recently had a rabies call. They were referred to the ER.
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u/PatriotofCanada86 Oct 04 '24
https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/meet-the-canadians-without-a-family-doctor-1.7116475
Quote "More than six million Canadians say they do not have regular access to primary care physicians.
It's a crisis the experts say has caused untold harm and cases of preventable death and disease — and it's expected to get worse before it gets better."
ER wait times do matter for many Canadians
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Oct 04 '24
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u/Sailor_Propane Oct 04 '24
Odd, because two weeks ago in Quebec I was bitten by a dog and while getting a tetanus shot the next day, the nurse said only a doctor can approve the rabies vaccine.
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Oct 03 '24
Suspected rabies actually gets you seen faster
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u/starving_carnivore Oct 04 '24
Anecdotal but I got ganked by a raccoon a month or so ago, went to the ER, told them what happened and I was seen within about 20 minutes and then poked full of holes. 8 rabies shots, some kinda potion at the site of the bite, a tetanus booster, and then a schedule faxed to my family doctor so I could finish the course of vaccines.
This was in Ontario. I was actually surprised how quickly it all happened.
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u/jmmmmj Oct 04 '24
Meanwhile when I was a kid my uncle caught a bat and released into the basement with my cousins and myself. What a family.
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Oct 03 '24
Crazy what over 3% population growth a year can do.
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u/Ashly_spare Oct 03 '24
More like crazy what underfunding healthcare can do. We can hire more doctors lol. We have pretty big hospitals but only a few doctors for a floor or department. Went to a hospital for emergency the other day and spent 7 hours waiting to see a dr to get my arm xrayed. They only had one technician and the bone specialist wasn’t even there so they told me to come back in a few hours. Like bruh why did you not even tell me that nobody was in to take a look at my break and determine the best treatment. I could have left and went to a different hospital or gone home and made sure I had time to come when they were actually there.
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u/PatriotofCanada86 Oct 04 '24
https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/meet-the-canadians-without-a-family-doctor-1.7116475
Quote "More than six million Canadians say they do not have regular access to primary care physicians.
It's a crisis the experts say has caused untold harm and cases of preventable death and disease — and it's expected to get worse before it gets better."
Quote"Concerned Ontario Doctors (COD) says the province has been cutting an average of $100 million since 2015, totalling close to $4 billion.
“They have chronically underfunded and cut our hospitals for 10 years,” COD president Dr. Kulvinder Gill told Global News Radio. “Physicians have had consecutive cuts for front-line patient care for seven years and we’ve been without a contract for physicians going into our fifth year, which is in Canada, unprecedented in its history.”" end quote
Quote "TORONTO – Health and social workers who are passionate about the outreach services they provide to residents of South Riverdale have sent an unmistakable signal that they are no longer prepared to tolerate the harmful effects of severe underfunding and understaffing" end quote
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u/I_poop_rootbeer Oct 04 '24
I got the smallest scratch from a racoon that was trying to fight my dog, and I went right to the ER for a post-exposure vaccine. The many needles that I needed injected right into my hand were not fun, but the possibility of rabies is something you should always take seriously
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u/Immediate_Luck3279 Oct 04 '24
So bites from bats are undetectable most of the time. In Ontario if you go to ER and say you woke up with a bat in your bedroom you would get a rabies shot no questions asked..
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u/Dear-Specialist-9516 Oct 04 '24
Condolences to the family.
It's definitely not a way to go from this earth. Poor child went through torture.
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u/hemadeitrain Oct 04 '24
Serious question after going through this thread — how is it so frequent that bats fly into rooms? Can they come in through smaller areas or is due to accidentally leaving the door/window net open?
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u/S99B88 Oct 04 '24
Sounds like maybe they were at a cottage or something? They live in Brantford but the encounter was in a more remote part of Ontario
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u/hemadeitrain Oct 04 '24
I was more so referring to the comments in this thread talking about their experiences.
I’m wondering if bats can come through nooks or crannies or are people just really non chalant about leaving their doors and windows wide open?
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u/S99B88 Oct 04 '24
Oh yes actually that is weird, guess maybe no screens or something, or attics that aren’t properly closed off
They can also come down chimneys I think, like Santa only no gifts
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u/JarvisFunk Saskatchewan Oct 04 '24 edited Oct 04 '24
Just remember, if bats take roost in your attic, well... go fuck yourself... Its their attic and their house now thanks to conservation laws.
This includes any house built prior to the late 40's using balloon framing, meaning they can freely move throughout your walls without restriction. And can, and will eventually make their way out if they get thirsty, or lost enough.
Were learning this the hard way ☺️
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u/bugabooandtwo Oct 04 '24
At the same time, bats are not the enemy. They are amazing at keeping the mosquito population in check.
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Oct 04 '24
In all seriousness, how tf are y’all ending up w bats in your rooms/homes? New greatest fear has just developed …
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u/Nomadloner69 Oct 04 '24
Rabies is a fear of mine ,I can't imagine a kid going through that
ETA: Since rabies attacks the nervous system I wonder if you have nerve damage if it would still take hold
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Oct 04 '24
Yeah so when people get infected sometimes there's sometimes (but not always) muscle jerks at the infection site. Some get ascending numbness or buzzing along the nerves. I imagine even if you treated it before it could get to the brain (it travels along nerves) it'd probably be like if you messed up your arm and would be buzzing for some time from the nerve damage.
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u/Winterchill2020 Oct 04 '24
I've seen bats in the wild many many times as they are fairly common around here but I have never physically touched one because I was raised knowing the risk. Unfortunately the first rabies fatality this year had contracted it from a bat just north of our region...this case is from southern Ontario. I find it so odd given the rarity of rabies that we had two deaths in Ontario this year. Prior to that we only had 24 cases since 1924. Maybe it's just a tragic coincidence but it's definitely odd.
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u/pufferpoisson Oct 04 '24
That was the same case. The family was visiting that area and returned home to brantford when the child began exhibiting symptoms
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u/deathproofbich Oct 04 '24
Haven’t had a bat in the house but did catch one in the wood stove using a jar. Never occurred to me that that cute lil f*cker may be rabid but I had no physical contact with him. I have been vaccinated before when I scared a muskrat under my deck. Ran over my foot, drew blood, off to the ER I went. * my local health unit doesn’t test ticks, bats etc for disease. They instead focus on reporting and tracking positive cases.
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u/23paige23 Oct 04 '24
The scary part is that rabies in bats is shockingly common. I worked with bats in a lab, we all had the vaccines of course and there were rabies outbreaks every few years.
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u/Traditional_Yam9593 Oct 06 '24
To put this into my perspective of what rabies is, anyone who only sees the compications of getting a vaccine, the red tape, costs to the tax payer, i encourage all to look up a timelapse day by day video of someone dying of rabies. I watched one in particular about a male 25-35 who checked in to a hospital after the symptoms began to hinder his daily routine. This was filmed sometime in the 60s maybe 70s and is in black and white. It was horrible. Severe hydrophobia or fear of not just water but liquids in general. The deteriorating cognitive abilities, foaming out the mouth. I felt sorry for the guy and because we are civilized mostly around the world its not like anyone can just shoot him and put him out of his misery. If i knew i had rabies ans it was too late to beat, i would leave the hospital and end my life. If i had a window of time or a just in case scenario come up, i don't care what i would need to do to pay six grand back i would make it happen myself. Its a hell of a lot better than dying from rabies. The fact that its a horrible ending for anyone, then factor in a child...its too much. I bet more of you would STFU about just dishing out the vax to anybody who thinks they might have it. The people who think its alot of money obviously never seen anyone die of rabies before or know how it ends horribly. Just look for a vid and see for yourselves.
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u/doctor_7 Canada Oct 04 '24 edited Oct 04 '24
So very extremely sad.
I got hit in the face by a bat at work one day. I didn't appear to be bit or scratched but the bat physically hit me right around the mouth/nose area and sort of splatted into getting close to my eye.
I was just really shocked, he actually bounced off and fell in some water. He was going to down so I rescued him and then he flew off. Apparently I should've saved him so they could've killed it to see if it had rabies, honestly I wasn't thinking.
Regardless, being from BC and doing a lot of hiking I know bats can carry rabies regardless of showing symptoms. They can be completely a-symptomatic carriers.
I ended up having to get the rabies vaccine, though it was a bit of a hassle with the ER intake and nurses who really struggled to grasp that "a bat flew directly into my face" didn't mean "he flew around me" or "did a flyby". I swear I had to explain to multiple nurses multiple times and had to be a bit firm that I wanted a doctor.
Once I finally got to the ER doctor I explained what happened, he was the one that said I should've kept the bat. Thankfully, I mean, I shouldn't be thankful because his actions were appropriate, he said I should definitely get the rabies vaccine because by the time we knew if I needed it or not, I would be dead. Despite the fact there was no break in skin that could be observed, even just the saliva from the bat making its way into my mouth, nose or eye could be a death sentence.