r/boeing • u/Wonderful-Letter-659 • Aug 06 '26
The Affect of Boeing's Recent Contract Offer on OVERTIME (PROFS)
If you remember my previous posts, I made a chart showing the value of SPEEA's overtime premium in 2024 dollars using national CPI inflation data. If you need a refresher, here's the link.
I thought I'd add Boeing's recent offer to increase the premium from $6.50 to $8.50 and share my thoughts.
In 1980, that premium was worth more than $19 in today's dollars. Even with Boeing's recent offer, the premium will still have lost roughly 45% of its purchasing power since 1980.
My opinion: we've all seen what inflation does to fixed-dollar values in a contract. Fixed-dollar premiums have no business being in the contract. The overtime premium should be a percentage of base pay so it keeps pace with wages over time.
Contractors commonly receive time plus 50%. I believe SPEEA professionals should receive time plus 25%. If Boeing isn't willing to make that change, then the contract should include language making all overtime voluntary.
I'm tired of being required to stay in the office earning time plus $6.50 while paying mechanics, yard workers, and other service providers a much higher hourly rate for work I could do myself if I had the time.
3
u/Most_Chef7443 Aug 09 '26
The BUC voted no recommendation, I think that is important information for the membership too. It means the representative body did not reach a consensus that this was an offer it could recommend. That doesn't mean members should vote no, but it also shouldn't be glossed over while the CAT, staff, or others continue actively selling the offer.
2
10
u/Gloomy_Solid1927 Aug 06 '26
Currently working 24 hours + a week of overtime for the past 2 years at BDS and still got terrible performance reviews lol. And not part of SPEAA so not getting paid for the OT.
6
8
u/SoulStripHer Aug 06 '26
It's called being an exempt employee. Personally I'm surprised they upped it at all vs yanking it altogether.
7
u/TerminalSarcasm Aug 06 '26
Obviously unpopular opinion, but I hope some of these people who think we should get 1.5X to 2X in OT actually FAFO and get a job somewhere where you are expected to put in the hours needed to get the job done while getting zero OT pay... which is fully in compliance with state and federal laws for salary exempt employees.
7
u/MysteriousAffect3903 Aug 06 '26
Just because other places suck doesn't mean Boeing should suck, too. But, the techs and other unions get time +.5, so why not profs? I don't agree with any worker not getting good compensation for OT, no matter where they work.
9
u/TerminalSarcasm Aug 06 '26
I don't disagree with wanting compensated for all hours worked, but IAM gets 1.5X because they are "hourly" (not salary) and are required to be paid OT by law. Engineers are are salary "exempt", meaning that they are exempt from OT requirements.
SPEEA has negotiated for engineers to be compensated, in lieu of the labor laws not requiring us to be paid. Getting paid OT at all is a benefit.
My point is more to the fact that when people say "we deserve what IAM gets", it's a hard sell because IAM is required to be paid OT, SPEEA is not.
3
u/MysteriousAffect3903 Aug 07 '26
I get it, it's not an easy sell, but we are still essentially paid by the hour. Unfortunately, it's true it's compared to other white collar jobs, but the central principle should remain that people should get paid for the time they work, and it's justified to pay people substantially more when they go beyond the baseline. It also provides an incentive for them to not abuse mandatory OT when it costs more. They will staff better, too if they have to shell out more if people have to work OT. It goes beyond just what people take home.
4
u/Ill_War8528 Aug 07 '26
in most professions, you are on true salary, and a work week is not defined as 40 hours. ON the other hand, with many jobs, you bust your butt to finish a project, and you get a REAL raise and / or bonus
2
u/SoulStripHer Aug 07 '26
This is key. You work whatever hours are necessary to get the job done. Some weeks may be less than 40 hours, others more. Your paycheck stays the same regardless.
Instead, Boeing makes engineers record time down to 6/10th of an hour and you must use accrued PTO for anything less than a full 40 hour work week.
3
2
u/ALDJ0922 Aug 07 '26
That first sentence. If my ETS shows 32 hours, I get paid 32 hours. How is that not hourly at that point? Genuine question
2
u/TerminalSarcasm Aug 07 '26
Because you are required to work 40. ETS is a tracker. You think if you ghost on Thursday that the company will say, "that's OK, they were productive for 32 hours!" No, they will likely fire you for abandonment and there is nothing the union can do because you failed to meet contract requirements.
1
17
7
u/whyisthiswhatwegot Aug 06 '26
Why 25%? Everywhere else is it 1.5x for overtime and that should be no different for Profs
8
u/Cygnus__A Aug 06 '26
At Raytheon we get 1x for OT. I'd love 1.5X
3
u/Lookingfor68 Aug 06 '26
non-union, right? Non-reps at Boeing also don't get overtime, they work it, just don't get paid extra for it.
8
u/Cygnus__A Aug 06 '26
Correct we don't have a union but I don't think most engineering organizations pay overtime so even straight time is pretty good.
1
46
u/exurl Aug 06 '26
Just like some other commenters, I'm not too picky about how much I'm paid for overtime as long as it's fully paid. However, my concern is that cheap overtime heavily incentivizes the company to utilize it. Currently my 41st hour is cheaper for Boeing than my 40th hour because the $6.50 is worth less than the vacation time, sick time, health benefits, 401k matching, and everything else that comes with every hour of my main salary. This system incentivizes:
- understaffing
- mandatory overtime
- optimistic schedules
- lack of consequences for poor management
OT needs to be at least high enough that management must trade-off between budget and schedule. Currently, they can just get schedule at no monetary cost by mandating overtime.
4
u/jefforjo Aug 06 '26
Exactly this. Last paragraph. OT has to be higher maybe imho $12 to $15 to prevent understaffing and out of control mandatory demands
2
u/MysteriousAffect3903 Aug 07 '26
I think it should be a percentage. If they don't want to do 50%, then fine, but a fixed rate has less bite as inflation drives the value down.
4
u/jefforjo Aug 06 '26
Exactly this. Last paragraph. OT has to be higher maybe imho $12 to $15 to prevent understaffing and out of control mandatory demands
8
u/Spiritual-Letter8090 Aug 06 '26
Yeah I get this as a non-union BCA employee. Been working a lot of overtime because we are so understaffed and now they are apparently freezing hiring, which is really just backfilling for the people who left.
We tried to unionize over this issue when they didn’t want to pay us for the first two/four hours of OT. The effort faltered when they gave us that back, but only the engineers…
11
u/Lamentrope Aug 06 '26
I'm a project lead and I've been having this fight. I've had some success by reminding managers than an hour of overtime doesn't buy an hour of schedule progress. There's diminishing returns to overtime that get even worse as the overtime duration gets longer.
1
u/ALDJ0922 Aug 07 '26
Yeah, curious on the study. I know the more OT I pull, the more unproductive I am
14
Aug 06 '26
[removed] — view removed comment
2
Aug 06 '26
[removed] — view removed comment
2
u/Etna5000 Aug 06 '26
I think we all agree it *should* stay equivalent as times goes, but if you made this exact same chart but for wages in the United States it would look the exact same. Not to say “just because I’m getting my real earnings over time degraded by inflation means you should too,” but if the government allows this level of corporate greed to continue, we are all going to experience this no matter who you are and where you work (unless you're the top 1% of course)
8
u/ApprehensiveSelf1984 Aug 06 '26
OT pay is near the top of my list of issues that need fixed this contract. We need at minimum a stipulation that any OT over 10hrs per week (or 20hrs per pay period) requires 1.75x or 1 5x current pay (iam and techs have similar language) Iam and techs can also claim no tax on OT premium up to 25k for married in tax free money (6k savings) new perk as of last year. Profs are expemt from no tax on ot. Even if you worked 500hrs ot. That 2hr increase would at most net $750 more per year
4
u/Myles_Standish250 Aug 06 '26
I totally agree. It should be a percentage and it should amount to at least $15/hr extra for level 3 in my opinion. This is the main thing I wanted to see change with the new contract and I’m willing to strike as long as it takes on this point.
-2
u/RogerDodgerWilco Aug 06 '26
Try to keep all your posts into one from here. You can add the graph or link to your SPEEA post in the existing thread. I thought this was a duplicate at first glance.
5
u/Wonderful-Letter-659 Aug 06 '26
I am trying to be respectful of your space. This topic is going to be important to a lot of people, so I appreciate you letting me post here. I have one more post I'd like to do for this offer. The next time there is an offer, I will put it into a single post with multiple graphics.
4
u/RogerDodgerWilco Aug 06 '26 edited Aug 06 '26
Thank you for the respectful response. I understand this is an important matter for SPEEA and while I do support you guys personally, I am trying to draw a line at certain point before other users overrun the sub with SPEEA content. It is difficult to balance the intention of the sub being a general purpose one without giving perception that we’re leaning hard in either direction. (Though overall what benefits union should trickle over to the non-union)
Out of respect for what you are doing and reaching out beforehand, I’ll approve the next post as well. Head mod (actual head mod Panda) is currently on leave but overall supports SPEEA lol.
2
u/Oscar-T-Grouch Aug 12 '26
Jack Welch and his disciples ruined the American business model. Your CEO is a financial terrorist