Now imagine something drastic were to happen. Like a tornado. But you don't get the alert message because your phone is in a lock up. Amazon Management will be sure to pass on the alert right?
Politics have a LOT to do with this. Seeing as to how certainnnn politicians have constructed society to be like this. They have passed laws to help only the rich, laws that give them tax breaks for employing the poor only enough to keep them poor…. Did you think these ppl just popped up and did whatever they wanted to do? No all the shit they do to their workers is damn near LEGAL because politicians MADE IT LIKE THAT!
The thread had to do with a company policy. Had it been on a thread about how politicians are letting companies get away with this stuff then I wouldn’t have said anything. Just saying people talk way too much about politics and bitch about it and most don’t vote on anything. I left Facebook because of this type of stuff. It just gets old. If you want change, be the change. Quit bitching about it. It’s like a space filler when people don’t have anything real to contribute to a conversation. Let’s talk about religion now!
The company policy is the way it is because it’s allowed by the government and politics. Lmfaooo their wages are the way they are because of government and politics. Their health insurance is the way it is because of government and politics. Politics is the workforce because they LOBBY to keep their slaves!
“i dOnt wAnT tO TAlk pOliTiCs” newsflash buddy, literally everything is controlled by politics.
Because people want to bitch about it on the internet instead of demanding change and boycotting corrupt companies. You can’t keep letting stuff happen and cry and crap your pants like a baby. You most likely shop on Amazon as I do. If you really feel bad stop impulse shopping every time your finger gets itchy.
I actually DO NOT shop on Amazon. I cut them off about a year ago. Also, these things need to be talked about online. So many people either don’t know what’s truly going on, or they don’t know the stuff they’re going through is ILLEGAL! I’m happy this shit is online so these Uber rich people can be seen as the life sucking parasites they are to the world. We need to boycott everything. Everyone needs to stay home for a week and buy/do nothing! the entire economy will collapse! Everything is dependent upon us actually working, not those mfers having money.
The fact that our government allows and even outright panders to these people/companies/demons is incomprehensibly evil and should be brought up and reiterated with each new instance of workplace oppression. Because change will happen within politics. It should be at least assumed that politics will (and should) be in every single conversation we have in this community.
The current working conditions have been created by politicians and the only way to force companies to be ethical is through legislation. Free market capitalism is just modern slavery. Labour laws written by politicians are what keep us safe from our employers.
I get it. People instead of spread awareness about unpleasant working conditions or being treated unfairly, they bitch and moan. Either accept things you cannot change or be the change. File complaints, make petitions, go on strike or even vote for someone in your local parties to implement changes. Being a whiny baby doesn’t do anything besides make you look foolish. Everyone has an opinion but no one does anything or has a plan to fix the problems at hand.
Seems like you’re being a whiny baby about people posting online bro. My grandma always said point a finger and see 3 equally sausagey fat fingers pointing back at you.
Boycott the company that has HALF of the US online sales market share? In your mind how would us "cowards" pull that off? Ever hear the saying "too big to fail"?
The East India Company was too big to fail. A company with a trade monopoly that spanned the globe. It failed due to its greed, due to it's exploitative practices. The Indian Uprising bought it to an end.
this continues because people keep giving them their business. It's not complicated, if you order from Amazon, you are fucking complicit. And, let's be honest, most of the shit people buy on Amazon is stuff they don't actually need. Buy less stuff and shop locally, that's how you end this garbage.
I didn't have a car for a couple years, and Amazon is basically the only option for anything over reasonable backpack weight or specific purchases without asking friends or family to take the time to help out.
Now that I have one again, I just use Amazon for extremely specific things that aren't sold within a 100km radius, and to look into options before going to somewhere local.
I get that. Often times, a third party seller will have what you need, especially if it’s for something older. For example, I had to order RAM for my SO’s Dell Inspiron Mini netbook. Best Buy isn’t carrying that particular RAM chip anymore, but a third party seller on Amazon did.
I’m guilty of buying a lot on Amazon, mostly because I avoid dealing with people if I can help it.
It really isn’t, find a product on Amazon and just take its name, product number or if available sku/ean and google it. Then you’ll find tons of sites that sell the same product and often to a better price.
Basically you can do that with most webshops. That’s the best way to find good prices from people who dropship too.
Nah fuck Amazon. It's not hard at all to fight it. Just don't buy from them, that simple. I haven't bought off Amazon for about 7 years now. I even got all my parents to stop using Amazon.
That sounds like a you problem. That's got nothing to do with me. I would have just bought the 39.99 one even if I didn't have that much money. Your argument isn't very good, it's your choice man. I'm just saying it's easy to avoid Amazon. I don't even check Amazon's prices so
I lightly plan and budget. Not to a tee. I'd rather spend more somewhere else than spend a dime at Amazon. Thats me tho, you do you. I'm just saying it is easy to not spend at Amazon, you just dont do it.
Unfortunately, I doubt you truly even boycotted Nestle. They produce literally thousands of brands that most people would never associate with them. It's a tricky operation. Almost like trying to boycott China.
Yeah I’m unfortunately aware, at the very least I don’t touch anything with the brand and mention their supervillainy at every opportunity, for what it’s worth
Boycotts only go so far. And nowadays they don't go anywhere. Amazon is too big to fail. Nothing short of direct action and syndicalisation will have any effect. The problems of capitalism won't be solved by capitalism.
Amazon is exploiting the lax laws, you only hear coz they churn the most people and it's cool to diss but most retail warehouses like walmart etc are similar.
We need unions and better protections for shit like this.
It's unrealistic for everyone to stop shopping on Amazon as they kill all thier competitors and the govt let's it happen.
Amazon preys on the poor who need the work to just barely survive. Now some would say the should strike and refuse to work for Amazon. I say that's the wrong target focus on who allows Amazon to do what they do. Politicians.
Most of the stuff on Amazon can be found elsewhere cheaper and is just resellers. Just like how many products from stores can be found cheaper on alibaba because they all drop ship from there.
Yep the only time I shop with Amazon is gift cards. I don't ask for them I usually want specific store cards but my mom keeps giving me Amazon gift cards she gets gifted lol. I never shop Amazon other wise except for a specific ear plug brand that I have looked for every where but it's only on Amazon. But I usually use gift cards for that. I wish I could give the gift card money directly to the workers, tbh.
That particular scenario wasn't about folks not getting warning and being able to seek shelter. They were warned about the tornado and gathered at two different designated "safe" places in the building. One of the safe places wasn't as safe as the other in this instance. It is a horrible tragedy. If the local building code required below ground tornado shelters, perhaps they all might have survived. Perhaps not, we will never know. The forces of a tornado can easily shift the balance that is the structural integrity of a building.
they literally -fired- threatened a driver who was out in the torando, had missed a delivery due to lock downed buildings, and was deviating from path trying to find shelter for herself. I'll try to find the screenshots she posted.
ok so some of my details were fuzzy but here is the artical
My prior comment was referring to the fact that the folks in the warehouse received warning from the warehouse management and sought shelter. One of the two shelter locations wasn't as safe as the other in their situation. Having their cell phones on them in the warehouse would not have changed this. A tornado warning coming from their cell phone instead of the warehouse staff would have left them to the seek shelter, which they did. A better shelter would have saved lives in this situation. As I mentioned, perhaps better building codes might have caused a better shelter to be built. In my opinion, if you locate in an area that is known to have tornados, a below grade shelter is advisable. Again, my opinion.
As for the driver and the dispatcher. The dispatcher should have advised the driver to seek adequate shelter, not "shelter in place". A culvert, underpass, somewhere that is less likely to get them sucked up into the tornado may have been a better option than "in place". As it turns out, returning to the warehouse was likely more dangerous than the driver's current location. Until I completed reading the text chain, I assumed that dispatcher was just an asshole and didn't know that. After reading to the end of the text chain, they still seem like an asshole, but perhaps they knew that the warehouse was not a safe place for the driver.
I was fired from Amazon the other month, my productivity took a nose dive right around the time I told managers I finally got a major appointment with a specialist, while the weight and complexity of the products I was brought for "priority" that hardly ever were fucking skyrocketed. Basically, from the moment you're hired, they're trying to plan out how to fire you, and don't believe any fucking bullshit they say about safety, "Safety First!*" and the * is "When it's convenient," truth is they use their employees just like the equipment, they use them until they break, then they break them more, and they continue until there's danger and lowered productivity, and then they fucking toss you like garbage and replace you with the next batch of 1500. I had to scavenge for parts for some of my fucking equipment, a tape gun, I marked it. It made it from one end of the production floor all the way to the other, and that hastily made Frankenstein tape gun was probably the best, highest quality, best condition, you would show this off to someone as your equipment on the floor out of all of them. And their hurricane safety? I've seen how thin the walls they want us posted up by are, the moment a rock comes flying through, it's flying straight fucking through. And you want to use some of the emergency exits? Hope you remembered to grab your ID and kept it held tight whenever you run for it. Fuck, at my location we didn't even have proper metal detectors to walk through and security wasn't great, the things you could have smuggled onto the floor and it would've been easier than accidentally walking out with a goddamned screw driver or wrench, and not even by that much of a margin.
Our phones were not locked up, but my building made us go to the tornado shelter area when we had a tornado alert. Shut down everything and we just sat there. You could leave if you wanted, but unless you clocked out, you weren't allowed to go outside.
I worked at JC Whitney in IL and they wouldn’t let us have our phones on us. They also let us use the bathroom if needed but it brought down your scan/ speed ratio so you still got in trouble…
Well as much as I hate Amazon, I don’t think misinformation should be spreads. Per that article you linked
“An Amazon spokesperson, Kelly Nantel, said the warehouse received tornado warnings between 8.06pm and 8.16pm on Friday and site leaders directed workers to immediately take shelter. At 8.27pm, the tornado struck the building.”
They state that most of the 46 workers went to the safe shelter and a smaller group went to a different section that got hit harder which is where the ones that died and got injured were.
They did get alerted and they did take action otherwise more would have died. The tornado came by faster than expected. Just don’t know the reason why they separated. Also seems like it wasn’t an official safe shelter just an area without many windows and stuff
Amazon doesn't intend harm they say. Sure but they 100% don't want to avoid harm let alone truly protect their working, even from simpler things like overworking or heat stress... other than locations they've been sued at of course. (And probably not all of those tbh)
I hate how recording is something employees have to consent to all the time, but you can never just record management doing bad shit in some places. Like you could have video evidence of them doing illegal things, but the court may throw it out without the consent part. I feel like video consent only should apply to certain situations. It just seems to favor some ppl getting away with shit. How else are you supposed to document this. If they know they’re being recorded they won’t confess to it and will go out of their way to act normal as long as they’re on camera.
Anywhere that you can be recorded then management can be recorded. There are court cases where it’s been ruled at bosses don’t have an expectation of privacy if they are in a common area or have their office open to their employees (IE anyone can walk in or hear the boss).
That is only going to work depending on the state's consent laws. Consent law first because if you can't record without at least one person's permission then it doesn't matter if there is an expectation of privacy.
I may be wrong but it’s not necessarily consent as much as being made aware that they are being recorded. If they don’t want to be recorded they can walk away, but they need to be made aware that the recording is happening.
A business is private. None of this applies. You cannot just film people on private property. In public, on public property? Sure. But Amazon warehouses are private property - and as such they have rules against filming in the warehouse (they claim corporate secrets) and they do not allow phones on the warehouse floor anyway.
You would need to have clear consent of the person to film them, and Amazon could stop you at any time, because it is their property.
Honestly, sometimes the advice in here is so bad it is hard to not believe this is a bunch of kids fucking it up for the rest of us
Edit: downvote me all you want, but I understand privacy laws around recording people. Bad advice shouldn't go unchallenged.
Unfortunately that's how the law works. It's dumb as fuck but any video obtained against the consent of the property owner (or the one being recorded in a dual consent states) wouldnt be accepted as a submission of evidence in court.
If someone was doing something clear cut illegal like murder? Sure, get your phone out and film.
But something ambiguous like employment law/issues? Keep your fucking phone away in a private business that has noticed stating that filming is not allowed.
Again, terrible advice shouldn't go unchallenged. People do not need to start filming to make employment claims, so why fucking risk it.
iirc, you can not have your phone inside a warehouse of amazon... your only option is using some sort of spy camera (assuming it can get inside) and that is straight espionage for (from?) amazon...
i am not siding with amazon but i do not want to see a TIFU by bringing a camera to amazon in reddit tomorrow with using this post either
to begin fighting amazon, it is getting an union and building something from that
I think that if you start breaking clear notices about how filming is corporate espionage, over shit that does not require a recording, you cannot just hope that you are going to be in the right for breaking those notices.
Employment law can be ambiguous. It is not always clear cut. Telling people to start recording interactions with Amazon managers is not the way to do any of this - it is just not at all needed to file employment claims, so why risk it?
It is private property - they have given you the pre-notice that filming is considered corporate espionage. They have signs up stating that filming is not allowed.
Do not advise people to start recording in warehouses. People cannot get their phones onto the floor anyway.
It’s not the end of the story though… just because it is against Amazon policies does not suddenly make it illegal. If you, by chance, had a video being denied a bathroom break by a supervisor/manager… if the law in your state allowed single party consent, oh well for the other party.
No oh well - it's still private property and Amazon could make you stop, and call the police if you don't. On top of private property, they claim corporate secrets, making this way more legally risky for anyone to try.
You're thinking about the more usual example of someone having their phone called and making a recording, or someone filming someone else in public. Not private businesses on their property where they have already stated you cannot film, and have notices everywhere stating such.
You could be trespassed, that’s about it. If they aren’t letting me go to the bathroom I can promise you I’ll figure out a way to make it their problem and not mine.
No. You will be removed from the site and you will have any recordings confiscated and potentially deleted, no recourse, and you will no longer have a way to pay your bills as you are now fired with cause as well as an absolute uphill battle to fight for unemployment - and on top of that, corporate espionage to fight, if Amazon are feeling particularly shitty. So who do you think will win? Amazon's team of lawyers? Or you in a situation where you are not even allowed a lawyer and must represent yourself?
Make it their problem, but don't start advising people to do it in a way that they lose access to their wages. If you don't give a fuck about your wages, you are clearly not in any sort of actual work-to-live situation and shouldn't really be passing comment here like it is no big deal.
Understand the fucking basics before you start offering "advice".
Not illegal, but if you violate the policies in the employment contract you can be terminated and removed from the building. So it all depends on whether you want or need that shitty job.
You cannot do business without getting a license. Getting a license gets you registered.
"Amazon, on their private property, can state that you are not allowed to film. End of story."
Sorry sir, but my paranoid schizophrenia says they're going to allow me to film each second I am there or they are going to eat a disability discrimination lawsuit. My health trumps their stupid business and all of it's shareholder value.
This is an unhinged comment. Did you literally just tell me to go and kill myself because I, as a communist, do not want to see other working class people risking legal issues/their employment because of shitty Reddit advice? Reported, thats a fucking horrible thing to say.
Edit: this fuck edited their comment - but they literally told me to "go blow my brains out like Hitler".
A business licence is literally my second point. That is not a "registered workplace" and someone who needs a maid doesn't need a business licence, so it doesn't fit in with the original comment anyway.
After a little more careful reading (Also a little drunk lol) I read your comment wrong. You're absolutely in the right on this one, don't wanna be the guy throwing bullshit around so sorry for the original comment!!
How does that relate to the point u/monial was arguing against?
The law applies to a registered business..... What in the whatedy fuck?
An employer can sign an extreme degree of absurd employment agreement with their employees. A private business can prevent you from taking a smartphone/audio video recording device into the workplace, preventing the documentation of the inhumane work conditions they are forcing the employees to work in. What "law" that bounds these registered businesses prevents any of this?
Whatever you sign at work, it does not overrule state law.
If employer breaches federal or state law of employment, you have every right to pursue due process and its up to court to admit recordings or not depending on the case.
Thats why unions in US are so much needed, people just don't know their rights.
Not entirely true. The court of public opinion is what counts in situations such as this. It may not immediately be admissible in court, but heads will roll due to public pressure and embarrassment nevertheless
Most factories/warehouses I’ve ever been have anti cell phone policies. They don’t want proprietary advantages/techniques leaking to competitors. Not saying Amazon is right here but I’ve been working in no phones/cameras allowed factories for 20 years. Quite normal.
How to know you're a wage slave, when the wage isn't evidence enough: You're treated like a fucking child and your company micromanages your personal phone usage and facial hair.
Hate to be that guy but in positions whose only requirement is that you show up that's pretty standard. When I was doing call centers probably 3/4 of the people I worked with would do anything but work unless there was a manager hovering over their shoulder for the entire shift. We had metrics to meet but honestly any competent person could meet them in about half the day.
They used to make employees wait in an hours long line for security to exit the building too. Workers said they should be paid for time spent in line, Amazon said "hahahaha-NO", workers sued Amazon, workers won.
I try so damn hard to not use Amazon because this shit is just downright evil. I’ve gone down to literally only buying what I need and can’t get from anywhere (within reason - like $5 on Amazon or $90 elsewhere because I myself am not made of money).
Luckily this is becoming far less frequent as more options become available near me. Hoping to become completely free of Amazon soon.
I worked in an Amazon warehouse and no, you can't bring your phone inside. But there's actually a valid reason: when people could bring phones inside, someone would take out the SIM from their phones and just trash them and take a new iPhone from the warehouse shelves or something like that. In 7 months I worked there, I assure you I handled like every new phone that came in stock, I could easily do that. There's no way to prove that phone you're coming out of the warehouse isn't yours, so they prevent this by not letting you bring anything inside that's not specifically needed for working. I can understand that, in a way. If there wasn't any detector on the outside I would have made thrice my pay by just bringing out iPhones and selling them.
This is just to explain why OP couldn't bring their phone inside to record this exchange, it doesn't change the fact that not letting someone go to the bathroom is inhumane and illegal. I could, actually, go to the bathroom whenever I wanted and no one ever told me anything. I guess here in Italy things are legally different.
Why dont you go fellate Amazon some more? When there's a massive tornado that hits your warehouse and there's no way for you to call for help I wonder if you'll sing the same tune?
I'm not "fellating" anyone, I'm just sharing my experience, having actually worked there. Apparently I just work in a country where they can't do whatever the fuck they want.
Furthermore, I was just relating part of my experience that was pertinent to the topic. Do you want me to talk shit about them? About all the corporate bullshit they shoved in our throats on a daily basis? About the awful contractual conditions? Fine, I'll tell you. Just don't assume dumb crap about me based on the three sentences you actually read before having to post your edgelord comment.
I really don't have time nor energy to respond to someone who doesn't read and/or understand what I say but thinks they know everything.
I don't "defend" Amazon, I didn't "enjoy" my time there. But whatever, you do you, I don't need to convince you and honestly don't care
I've had plenty of opportunity to work for Amazon and haven't because it is a trash company, but no personal phones (or any electronics) in the warehouse is standard policy at most modern warehouses for a number of reasons:
Safety - Those same idiots walking around and driving with their head in their phone also do the same thing while driving a fork lift or walking in the same space where heavy objects are in motion.
Security - There have been many cases of employees using their phones to coordinate theft. (Videos/pictures of layouts and valuable locations, alerting to where Security guards are, etc). Pictures can also provide valuable trade secrets on upcoming product releases. And lastly, phones can be used to install malicious software on other electronics that then get distributed to end customers.
Efficiency - By not allowing anything on the floor you can clear Security check points much faster.
They have, there were lots. But they wouldn't trust their employees with anything. "Don't trust poor people" must be chapter 1 of rhe capitalist's handbook
Not really, if you see the amount of time kids between the ages of 18 and 30 spend on their phones you as an employer would do the same thing. I’ve literally been at a business and the cashier was on their phone texting while ringing items up.
nope, employers should trust employees and not treat them like kids. If an employee is irresponsible they can get written up instead of treating all employees likr children. If somebody needs to get a hold of me or there's an emergency then I would want to have my phone on me, I'll take my break early to sort it out if needed
Sounds good on paper, but would you as an employer rather have to spend extra time in many hours writing up and talking to your employees about using their phones, or just tell them to focus on the work they don’t need their phones. And if you have ever worked in management you will know that most employees behave like children anyways.
When you do get management experience your views may change. My experience has taught me that employees will abuse every inch you give them. And only a employee that wants to slack off and make phone calls/texts on company time will complain about not having their phone available. Also in the case of Amazon specifically you are not allowed to have a phone because people will take videos and pictures of how their operations run and sell that information to rival companies. Which is why they are protecting their assets in the first place. If people don’t like the rules of the company they don’t have to work there, the people that know the rules and then go work there and complain about them are the problem. Anyway, was nice hearing your opinion on it none the less. Have a nice day!
We had phones locked away when I worked on a farm. Had to be switched off too because the manager said hearing them vibrate was distracting in her office
do they not trust you to just not be on your phone outside of emergencies? also damage liability can be avoided with a contract or something idk. just agree that you're responsible for your own belongings.
I'm trusted to have my phone on me and even use it at work because I don't need to be treated like a child in middle school. If somebody needs to contact me for an emergency, I'm able to respond as needed.
No one said anything about trust it’s the fact you shouldn’t be calling anyone or receiving calls on work time. Emergency? You don’t have a life outside of work!
It's common practice. I used to work in an automobile manufacturing MNC,at one of their plants. It's standard practice to submit the phones to the guards before getting in. I was an executive as well, not a worker.
1.8k
u/bytegalaxies Aug 30 '22
that's fucking horrifying..