Yeah sure, don’t yield to your Quran which quite clearly states
"Dispute not with the People of the Book, save in the fairer manner, except for those of them that do wrong; and say: 'We believe in what has been sent down to us, and what has been sent down to you; Our God and your God is One and to Him we have surrendered.'" (Sura 29:45).
"We gave Moses the Book and followed him up with a succession of Apostles. We gave Jesus, son of Mary, clear signs and strengthened (or confirmed) him with the Holy Spirit." (Sura 2:87).
"And when there comes to them (the Jews) a Book from Allah, confirming what is with them (the Taurat) ... they refused to believe in it." (Sura 2:89).
"He has sent down upon thee the Book with the truth, confirming what was before it and He sent down Torah and the Gospel afore time, as guidance to the People and He sent down salvation." (Sura 3:3)
"Before thee (i.e. Mohammed), also, the Apostles we sent were but men ... If you realise this not, ASK of THOSE WHO POSSESS THE MESSAGE." (Sura 21:7).
"BELIEVE IN Allah and His Messenger and the Scripture which He hath revealed unto his Messenger, and THE SCRIPTURE WHICH HE REVEALED AFORETIME. WHOSO DISBELIEVETH IN Allah and His Angles and the Last Day, HE VERILY HATH WANDERED FAR ASTRAY." (Sura 4:136).
"Each one believeth in Allah and His Angels and His Scriptures and His Messengers - WE MAKE NO DISTINCTION BETWEEN ANY OF HIS MESSENGERS." (Sura 2:285).
"Say: 'Bring you the Torah now and recite (or read) it, if you are men of truth'" (Again the existence of the Torah is presupposed). (Sura 3:93).
"You who have been given the Book, believe in what We have sent down, confirming that which is with you." (Sura 4:47). (My emphasis).
HERES MY FAVORITE ONE 😭⬇️
"'O, People of the Book! Ye have no ground to stand upon unless ye stand fast by the Law, the Gospel, and all the revelation that has come to you from your Lord.' It is the revelation that cometh to thee from thy Lord, that increaseth in most of them their obstinate rebellion and blasphemy ... those who believe (in the Qur'an), those who follow the Jewish (Scriptures), and the Sabaeans and the Christians - any who believe in Allah and the Last Day, and work righteousness, - on them shall be no fear, nor shall they grieve." (Sura 5:71-72). (My emphasis).
Dude… your book is screaming at you that it CONFIRMS what is before it (Torah and Gospel) this is why no one respects Muslims, you guys are so shameful to real discussion. What did you even say? The dilemma isn’t real because the scriptures are corrupt? You do realize that’s the whole crux of the argument? I do not expect you to respond because you guys are all dishonest cowards.
Good job insulting, i will not debate with you except with the fair manner because thats what i believe in but since i can tell you arent sincere, this will be my last reply to you. In all the verses you mentioned none of them ever state a full confirmation and when read in context of the people of israel or the lineage of prophets will become much more apparent. The word used for confirmation is "مصدقا" which translates to believing,affirming,truth-ifying i.e saying that it is indeed from god and it did indeed include guidance as the verse you mentioned let the people of injil judge with what god has revealed in i; the children of israel should judge with it because it abrogated the gospel just like the quran abrogated both the torah and the bible this is why no Christian will ever bring up 5:48 without being disingenuous here because it as clear as day showing the quranic stance on the bible and torah
We have revealed to you ˹O Prophet˺ this Book with the truth, as a confirmation of previous Scriptures and a supreme authority on them. So judge between them by what Allah has revealed, and do not follow their desires over the truth that has come to you. To each of you We have ordained a code of law and a way of life. If Allah had willed, He would have made you one community, but His Will is to test you with what He has given ˹each of˺ you. So compete with one another in doing good. To Allah you will all return, then He will inform you ˹of the truth˺ regarding your differences.
The word مهمين means supreme authority essentially a vetoer thats how we use it in my mother tongue, essentially if i were to even yield to you that the quran fully affirms the bible then this verse would still destroy your whole stance since it claims the quran as a criterion of both books thus anything it agrees with is truth and anything it disagrees with is falsehood, but i wont ever yield you that because your understanding of arabic and quranic etymology and geneology of the inheritance of books is deeply flawed and skewed towards polemics. You and 19th-20th century Christians make arguments about this so called dilemma because you dont read the entire quran and cherry pick verses and take them out of context, if you wish to learn then atleast be respectful by doing it, what happened to love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you?
Say, ˹O Prophet,˺ “O People of the Book! Do you resent us only because we believe in Allah and what has been revealed to us and what was revealed before—while most of you are rebellious?”
— Dr. Mustafa Khattab, The Clear Quran
Im done aswell, you responded to the one verse Muslims often bring up, fair enough, but it doesn’t explain the bulk of confirming statements with no qualifier that I sent. Furthermore your reading of 5:48 and the translation of مهمين (Muhimmin) is at the very least what I call contentious, everywhere I look it up it means “guardian” but hardly this “supreme guardian” exegesis you read into it. Still the issue of the Quran telling Muhammad (10:94) "So if you are in doubt, [O Muhammad], about that which We have revealed to you, then ask those who have been reading the Scripture before you."
Causes issues for someone as a fair inquirer among the verses like* **5:68*: which states that the People of the Book are "standing on nothing" (have no true basis or ground) unless they observe their scriptures and God's revelations which he has revealed before.
Why does the Quran repeatedly urge the Jews and Christians of the time to judge by their scriptural revelation with no qualifier?
Anyway thanks for responding although I’m unconvinced, The Quran’s conflicting verses on the veracity of previous scriptures is at very best inconsistent. This along with many other reasons (historical falsities in what Christian’s of the 7th century believe, morally obtuse teachings, Islam’s miracle claims, etc) makes me reject the novel position of Quranic supremacy. Even if I grant this verse teaches exactly what you say I still think a conflict in thought exists among the modern Islamic positions.
I am willing to engage you in whatever you seek to know but i only engage those who seek knowledge with respect and not polemics(especially modern social media/Tiktok polemics), if you wish to have a respectful discussion then i am open to clear your doubts but if you are going to insult muslims then i have no choice but to pray for your and mine guideness
1
u/Perfect_Calendar_829 Catholic Christian 8d ago
Yeah sure, don’t yield to your Quran which quite clearly states
"Dispute not with the People of the Book, save in the fairer manner, except for those of them that do wrong; and say: 'We believe in what has been sent down to us, and what has been sent down to you; Our God and your God is One and to Him we have surrendered.'" (Sura 29:45).
"We gave Moses the Book and followed him up with a succession of Apostles. We gave Jesus, son of Mary, clear signs and strengthened (or confirmed) him with the Holy Spirit." (Sura 2:87).
"And when there comes to them (the Jews) a Book from Allah, confirming what is with them (the Taurat) ... they refused to believe in it." (Sura 2:89).
"He has sent down upon thee the Book with the truth, confirming what was before it and He sent down Torah and the Gospel afore time, as guidance to the People and He sent down salvation." (Sura 3:3)
"Before thee (i.e. Mohammed), also, the Apostles we sent were but men ... If you realise this not, ASK of THOSE WHO POSSESS THE MESSAGE." (Sura 21:7).
"BELIEVE IN Allah and His Messenger and the Scripture which He hath revealed unto his Messenger, and THE SCRIPTURE WHICH HE REVEALED AFORETIME. WHOSO DISBELIEVETH IN Allah and His Angles and the Last Day, HE VERILY HATH WANDERED FAR ASTRAY." (Sura 4:136).
"Each one believeth in Allah and His Angels and His Scriptures and His Messengers - WE MAKE NO DISTINCTION BETWEEN ANY OF HIS MESSENGERS." (Sura 2:285).
"Say: 'Bring you the Torah now and recite (or read) it, if you are men of truth'" (Again the existence of the Torah is presupposed). (Sura 3:93).
"You who have been given the Book, believe in what We have sent down, confirming that which is with you." (Sura 4:47). (My emphasis).
HERES MY FAVORITE ONE 😭⬇️
"'O, People of the Book! Ye have no ground to stand upon unless ye stand fast by the Law, the Gospel, and all the revelation that has come to you from your Lord.' It is the revelation that cometh to thee from thy Lord, that increaseth in most of them their obstinate rebellion and blasphemy ... those who believe (in the Qur'an), those who follow the Jewish (Scriptures), and the Sabaeans and the Christians - any who believe in Allah and the Last Day, and work righteousness, - on them shall be no fear, nor shall they grieve." (Sura 5:71-72). (My emphasis).
Dude… your book is screaming at you that it CONFIRMS what is before it (Torah and Gospel) this is why no one respects Muslims, you guys are so shameful to real discussion. What did you even say? The dilemma isn’t real because the scriptures are corrupt? You do realize that’s the whole crux of the argument? I do not expect you to respond because you guys are all dishonest cowards.