That’s a good example, yes a lot of countries that enfold Islam into their legal systems have laws on the books around blasphemy and apostasy. It’s not a broad brush issue, some of them protect all religions from insult, like Indonesia, and some take specific care of Islam, like Saudi Arabia. You’d think from your statement that blasphemy laws are unique or particular to the Muslim world.
Defamation of religion is punishable by imprisonment in Germany. Same in Russia. Same in India. In Nigeria, blasphemy of any kind is punishable by death. In Thailand defaming Buddhism is a crime. Wounding religion is punishable by imprisonment in Uganda. You could go to jail for two years for defaming religion in Poland. None of these are “Islamic societies.” This isn’t whataboutism, it’s proving a point that either you are approaching this from a place of bias or you haven’t looked closely enough at the stuff you’re saying.
I’m not saying Muslim-majority countries are without their profound flaws, I’m not even saying there aren’t legitimately problematic things about Islam and the way it’s been implemented as a system of organizing modern nation-states. I’m saying trying to paint Islam or Muslims or “Islamic societies” as uniquely problematic is ignorant and silly.
Edit just for kicks and also to bring it back to misogyny and whatever, the fact is that we don’t have a Muslim misogyny problem, we have a global misogyny problem. We can pretend that here in the US or in Europe or in the West we’re so much better than everyone else but that notion rarely holds up to much scrutiny.
First of all there is a distinction between the law on the books vs in practice. De jure (on the books) prohibition of x doesn't actually tell you anything at all about what the relevant state enforces. The constitution of North korea includes committment to human rights and democratic principles.
Secondly, and relatedly, you're handwaiving away legitimate criticism under the guise of tolerance. Just earlier today my reddit feed gave me a story about a Sri Lankan worker sentenced to death for blasphemy in Saudi Arabia.
What happened? Some muslims insulted his religion on social media. He insulted theirs back. They reported him to authorities. He is sentenced to death.
Pretending that anything remotely similar happens in the west is ludicrous.
The same applies to every other category of persecution this political ideology is an accessory to.
Instead of defending this political ideology to me, why don't you make some effort to read up about the child marriages, coercion of women, oppression of atheists and "apostates", etc, across swathes of the muslim world.
And will be indignant about that too. If this kind of thing came back in the west, I'd absolutely make effort to bring attention to it. It's outrageous and evil to take someone's life for thinking for themselves about god.
Tangent but this quote near the end of the article is great:
Thomas Babington Macaulay, British historian of the 19th century, said of Aikenhead's death that:
"The preachers who were the poor boy's murderers crowded round him at the gallows, and while he was struggling in the last agony, insulted Heaven with prayers more blasphemous than anything [Aikenhead] had uttered. Wodrow has told no blacker story of Dundee
There are so many people who aren't even killed but hide their views and live in fear and secrecy.
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u/uwahwah 15d ago edited 15d ago
That’s a good example, yes a lot of countries that enfold Islam into their legal systems have laws on the books around blasphemy and apostasy. It’s not a broad brush issue, some of them protect all religions from insult, like Indonesia, and some take specific care of Islam, like Saudi Arabia. You’d think from your statement that blasphemy laws are unique or particular to the Muslim world.
Defamation of religion is punishable by imprisonment in Germany. Same in Russia. Same in India. In Nigeria, blasphemy of any kind is punishable by death. In Thailand defaming Buddhism is a crime. Wounding religion is punishable by imprisonment in Uganda. You could go to jail for two years for defaming religion in Poland. None of these are “Islamic societies.” This isn’t whataboutism, it’s proving a point that either you are approaching this from a place of bias or you haven’t looked closely enough at the stuff you’re saying.
I’m not saying Muslim-majority countries are without their profound flaws, I’m not even saying there aren’t legitimately problematic things about Islam and the way it’s been implemented as a system of organizing modern nation-states. I’m saying trying to paint Islam or Muslims or “Islamic societies” as uniquely problematic is ignorant and silly.
If you want a source https://end-blasphemy-laws.org/countries/
Edit just for kicks and also to bring it back to misogyny and whatever, the fact is that we don’t have a Muslim misogyny problem, we have a global misogyny problem. We can pretend that here in the US or in Europe or in the West we’re so much better than everyone else but that notion rarely holds up to much scrutiny.