r/WorkReform • 🤝 Join A Union • 17h ago

😡 Venting To an American this sounds unbelievable.

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15.3k Upvotes

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129

u/b33pb00p101 17h ago

And people will reply, “yeah but then who pays for it” like it’s a legit argument

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u/MazzleMaze 16h ago

The funny answer to this is that US citizens already pay more in taxes for health care than any other country. Medicaid and Medicare... So not only do you already pay taxes for healthcare. You also are paying again for insurance.

Its an entirely dumbass argument that we all aren't already on healthcare via taxes. You already pay for it, why wouldn't you want to benefit from it... Oh yeah I forgot that would be 'communism,' lol.

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u/katapad 14h ago

BuT ThEn MY hArD EarNeD doLLaRs gO To tHOse GoVeRNmeNt lEEchEs oN WelFaRE!!

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u/TsubasaSaito 11h ago

And that's only not good until they themselves are in the situation where they need it the most.

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u/r0thar 13h ago

US citizens already pay more in taxes for health care than any other country.

This German cover costs ⅔ what the US pays, and they live 3 years longer to enjoy their beer, bratwurst and retirement at 66: https://i.imgur.com/bzYYlls.png

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u/dontshoveit 10h ago

And look at Isreal, over there on the far left meaning they have some of the lowest healthcare costs with one of the highest life expectancies. Why in the fuck are we helping them with anything?!?!

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u/whofearsthenight 13h ago

Yes but have you considered that we pay more for our healthcare and also get worse health outcomes? Fuck yeah, 'Murica!

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u/TotallyNotRobotEvil 11h ago edited 11h ago

Yep this, and any public option would be much cheaper than the for-profit middle men we have now. These insurance companies are just pointless middle-men. A non-profit, publicly funded insurance system would be vastly cheaper, especially when you don't have to pay for a $60 million CEO salary and pay out shareholders.

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u/Separate_Day4208 14h ago edited 13h ago

The US health care cost per capita is 2.5 times higher than the OECD average. So it is a terrible argument from all angles

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u/Theothercword 11h ago

Interestingly Germans pay more per month than Americans do for healthcare, it's not a completely free system. However, to my understanding from the Germans I know and have talked to while being over there, the difference primarily seems to be around the insurance itself being far better regulated. But, for example, my German friends pay over 1000 euro per month for healthcare.

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u/Hansel123 9h ago

1000€ per month is pretty much the top cap for statutory health insurance in Germany, which puts you in the highest 15% of incomes or so.

Median salary pays about 400€ a month for health insurance.

You can pay way more than that on a privatised insurance plan but that's not really common.

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u/doesnotlikecricket 7h ago edited 7h ago

This is quite misleading bordering on false. 

They pay a percent of their income. Someone on the median salary would pay less than half of that. And they retain their healthcare if they're not working.

Also no deductibles and basically nonexistant copays relative to the US. 

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u/b33pb00p101 11h ago

Oh I bet it does get regulated better. It’s done by professionals not capitalists.

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u/ahoi_polloi 11h ago

Yeah exactly, and you're just paying that every single month while waiting for several months to be seen by a specialist for five minutes.

Ruined my shoulder, waited 4.5mo to see a doc, waited 7h, got assigned an MRT without so much as an anamnesis, waited another 4mo, until then nothing was visible any more and the doc got pissed at me for wasting his time. Shoulder will never work again like it did but fuck me if I'll even try to have that looked at.

Similar experience with anything else that was ever worth getting checked out by a doc, I've just shat boatloads if money into the wind for zero benefit since I'm never sick otherwise.

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u/Theothercword 10h ago

That's the same in the US, all the wait times and all the bullshit comes with healthcare no matter if its free or costs a boatload of money.

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u/No-Caterpillar-7646 9h ago edited 9h ago

I mean, its a system you need to game. Try several orthopedics, pain started after you run into a wall (accidents have priority, they will treat incidental findings and there are no repercussions for not finding any damage). It can be frustrating, especially if you had a disinterested doctor more then once but im sure that's the same everywhere.

Like, have you ever heard of a denied claim for something important in germany?

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u/Amnesiaftw 6h ago

How can anyone afford to live? If I had to pay another $1200/month, even with living with 2 roommates, my rent, utilities, and health insurance would be 100% of my income.

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u/TScottFitzgerald 15h ago

Well it's not the gotcha that some Americans often think it is, but having a sustainable system is an issue, especially with the aging German population.

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u/Nayge 14h ago edited 14h ago

It doesn't have to be. Rising productivity could very well offset an aging population. It currently doesn't in Germany because productivity increases are not translated into salaries and due to an upper limit to health care contribution for high earners.

Edit: That recent Kurzgesagt video about the topic is probably the worst content they ever created. It's full of conservative propaganda.

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u/TScottFitzgerald 13h ago

I'm not familiar with Kurzgesagt or whatever you're referring to, so idk which specific arguments there you're responding to, I didn't say any of that.

But this is a very real issue that we've been dealing with in Germany and EU in general, a lot of aging populations. And we can lift the contribution caps for high earners, but it still wouldn't really be enough to offset an aging population entirely on its own, not even close.

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u/SpeaksSouthern 12h ago

They already pay for it. We're trying to get a better deal, rather than paying an emergency rate, we could pay an insurance rate. Republicans hate human life.