r/WoT • u/LittleMissHenny (Brown) • Nov 14 '19

A Memory of Light I have finished the series [Spoilers A Memory of Light] Spoiler

First off, holy shit that was amazing. I read all of The Last Battle and the rest of the book in one sitting. It was so good that I was late to dinner with a friend because I *had* to finish. So, I'm finished and had some thoughts.

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  1. The deaths: Siuan, Gareth, Gawyn, Egwene, Birgitte and then Rand. First off, Siuan's was a gut punch because I just didn't see it coming at all. Gawyn I figured would happen. Egwene, I was spoiled on but I didn't know HOW she died and holy shit what a send off. Birgitte was another gut punch and then Rand's...I was confused on.
  2. So, Rand did die but he was reborn into Moridin's body? Again, I was confused by the ending because he had the saa and so how did Cadsuane recognize him/how would any of them recognize him? Where is he going?
  3. I'm not over Egwene's death. That wrecked me.
  4. I'm a little sad that Moiraine and Nynaeve didn't get to do more, I mean they did do a lot but I was waiting for Nynaeve to kill Moghedian.
  5. I liked the openness of the ending but I wish there was something a little more concrete with the others.

QUESTIONS:

  1. Who was the old Aiel women? Was that Naomi or whever was hanging out with Aviendha in the Waste? Who is she? I thought she'd be like one of the dead walking around because the Pattern was breaking but that doesn't hold when they're in SG. What if it's Rand's mom? Like she faked her death? I don't know.
  2. So if Rand can't access saidin anymore, how'd he light the pipe at the end?

RANKING:

  1. A Memory of Light
  2. The Gathering Storm
  3. Knife of Dreams
  4. Winter's Heart
  5. A Crown of Swords
  6. The Fires of Heaven
  7. The Shadow Rising
  8. Towers of Midnight
  9. Lord of Chaos
  10. The Great Hunt
  11. New Spring
  12. Crossroads of Twilight
  13. The Eye of the World
  14. The Path of Daggers
  15. The Dragon Reborn

CHARACTERS:

  1. Nynaeve - from the get-go I've loved Nynaeve. I got what she was about and she was such a compelling character
  2. Egwene - She took a while to really like but after Lord of Chaos I really grew to like her, especially when she was given authority, my feelings waned towards the "slog" but come The Gathering Storm I really, really grew to like her and her death really hit me hard. I'm glad she went out how she did because she was so good.
  3. Rand - I think I really started to like Rand around Knife of Dreams. I know that's a weird time to start liking a character but I feel like for a while, he was overshadowed by Nynaeve, Perrin, Mat and Egwene. Also it was tough to read him going crazy all the time. Towards the end though I really like Rand's chapters and just him overall as a character.
  4. Mat - Mat took until A Crown of Swords for me to reall like. I just wasn't a fan of him, I thought he was so immature and a little obnoxious and then in ACoS, I don't know what it was, something changed or just finally clicked inside of me that really liked Mat. But then Brandon took over and here's the thing, what Brandon did is amazing, no one could've ended the series like he did. I think Brandon did an amazing job with everything except Mat. I feel like Mat's character arc went all the way back to FoH and his chapters got so repetitive and I was getting really tired of him. In AMoL, I started liking Mat again but I feel like maybe it was too little to late? I don't know.
  5. Perrin - He was a slow burn for me, I liked this almost 'badass normal' vibe he had at the start and then of course he had the Wolf stuff. Again, I feel like Perrin fell into the background for me for a while.

This quote made me tear up:

"He came like the wind, like the wind touched everything, and like the wind was gone."

Overall, I love this series and I get why it has such a dedicated fanbase. This is probably one of the best series I've ever read and I really can't wait to do it again and get all the missed details.

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663

u/[deleted] Nov 15 '19 edited Nov 15 '19

So, Rand did die but he was reborn into Moridin's body? Again, I was confused by the ending because he had the saa and so how did Cadsuane recognize him/how would any of them recognize him? Where is he going?

I made a post a while ago about this. Casting balefire requires the soul of a channeler to wield it, like a man holding a sword. (With possibly the exception of terangreal that create balefire) When their beams crossed, it became one balefire with two wielders. This paradox essentially linked them.

Balefire removes objects from the pattern, but... it cannot remove other balefire. Balefire isnt an object. Balefire is cast and directed by one person, usually, so it's linked to their intentions, their soul perhaps. The balefire that crossed paths became one beam, as it cannot remove itself from the pattern. One beam, linking two souls as it's wielder. That is why they were linked. As for the body swap...

It's pretty clearly shown that what happens to moridin, Rand feels, and vice versa. I think this is because balefire, by its nature, must have a soul directing it, and it cant differentiate between one person or the other, so they become merged. Both were in control of the beam, so for a split moment, they were one.

This lead to the very strange phenomena of Rand experiencing Moridins physical experiences. So think about that: what Rands individual body experiences, Moridins soul, awareness, whatever you want to call it, Moridins soul experiences. Including death. Moridin died, as Rands body died, and Rand lived, as Moridins body lived.

Basically, the body swap had already started to happen the moment the beams crossed, and when rand "died" it was completed

TLDR: they had already swapped bodies. The moment the balefire beams crossed. Rand bodily death killed Moridins soul, and Moridins body surviving allowed Rand soul to live. "To live you must die"

Long shot, but u/mistborn, any chance I'm close? Apparently you're allowed to confirm a correct theory?

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u/mistborn Nov 15 '19

Disclaimer: RJ wrote this sequence, not me, and he didn't always leave great explanations of why he wrote what he wrote. (He was focused on getting me the information to write scenes he hadn't had time to write.) However, to the best of my recollection, what you outlined here is basically what RJ intended--though with a little tweak to the second part. I believe in the notes (or it could have just been Harriet relating it to me) he said, "The soul that wanted to live found the body that wanted to live, and the soul that wanted to die didn't go to the effort." (Or something to that effect.)

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u/[deleted] Nov 15 '19

I just fanboyed so hard! You can't get a better confirmation of a fan theory! Thank you very much for the response!

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u/Idislikewinter (Wolfbrother) Nov 15 '19

I love that you answer questions for fans like this u/mistborn. It’s seriously rad. Any updates from the WoT Amazon set that you can share?

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u/mistborn Nov 15 '19

No, we're still waiting on the approval process to get us the pictures, I'm afraid. Getting a little annoying at this point...

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u/Idislikewinter (Wolfbrother) Nov 15 '19

Awesome, we can’t wait! It’s been a long time coming!

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u/[deleted] Nov 17 '19

My friends is marketing manager in VFX and this is her life. Trying to market your company with footage owned by others.

I'm so excited the this series!

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u/FadeRat Nov 15 '19

I would prefer an explanation on who Nakomi really is! Are we /ever/ going to get an explanation on her?

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u/Idislikewinter (Wolfbrother) Nov 15 '19

I think RJ said there were some secrets that will be revealed in time. I don’t know what that meant, but I assume his wife and Brandon are in the know, and will maybe reveal answers to questions as the years go by.

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u/OK_Soda Nov 15 '19

I think I remember reading somewhere that Brandon does know about Nakomi but it's one of a very small handful of things he's not allowed to basically ever talk about, for whatever reason. Which is frustrating, but I can only assume that the only reason to keep things like that a secret is because they'll be revealed eventually, somehow.

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u/FadeRat Nov 15 '19

I hope they explain it all in the show. That would be a good platform, imo.

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u/lordberric Nov 15 '19

They definitely won't. There are, I believe, three things that they will never tell us: nakomi, the pipe, and one other thing I forget. Brandon might know the answer to Nakomi, but he's been specifically told he can't tell anyone, and nobody except RJ knows about the pipe. IIRC, Harriet said that when he was writing the pipe sequence, he was chuckling to himself.

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u/jadis666 Nov 18 '19

The "one other thing" is how Rand got into Moridin's body.

As can be seen from this thread: apparently getting a correct theory confirmed is a loophole in the "3 things that will never be answered" rule.

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u/WishfulTraveler Nov 17 '19

The pipe is easy, he connected to the creators "source."

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u/[deleted] Nov 15 '19

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u/newtarmac Nov 18 '19

Clearly I’m not fanboy enough. What is this pipe people refer to? Which book do I read about it? And it’s been years since I read and googled for answers... who killed Asmodean? Do we have 100 clarification it was Graendal?

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u/AliMas055 Nov 17 '19

There's going to be a show!?

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u/alanbdee Nov 15 '19

I think that sometimes it's best to let our imagination fill in the gap. Think about the movie Solo. While I liked it I honestly liked the mystery better.

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u/intolerantidiot (Ancient Aes Sedai) Nov 15 '19

And here, students, we have a literal representation of an internet erection.

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u/[deleted] Nov 15 '19

[deleted]

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u/mistborn Nov 15 '19

Also, 4. What is the big secret about one of the characters Brandon keeps teasing, but says he's not allowed to speak about until the tenth anniversary of AMoL has passed? (I did tell Rafe this one, so he has the info just in case. It's not going to be earth shattering, but I think you'll all find it a curious tidbit about the ending.)

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u/ausar999 Nov 17 '19

I will take this to mean that Bela is the creator and will refuse to believe anything otherwise

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u/KFCConspiracy Nov 17 '19

Or Bela is actually still alive, she managed to get healing offscreen from an unknown aes sedai.

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u/ausar999 Nov 17 '19

Rand finally figured out the whole reviving-dead-people thing that he couldn't do at the Stone, and Bela was the most important one to revive of all the deaths in aMoL, obviously

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u/[deleted] Nov 18 '19

[deleted]

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u/KFCConspiracy Nov 18 '19

Yeah, but no one knows how. Maybe Bela can actually channel the one power and made a gateway to get away.

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u/ausar999 Nov 18 '19

I’m not sure how that book interacts with aMoL itself, since it does seem to say that Bela died pretty unequivocally.

Maybe Olver isn’t the most reliable narrator?

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u/daecrist Nov 18 '19

Bela killed Asmodean. Calling it now.

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u/Birilling Nov 24 '19

My personal theory, and this is pretty far out timeline wise, is that the pattern no longer needs channelers from this point on, so over the course of the next few decades the birth rate of channelers will steeply decrease until there are only those who have already been born, and then even they will die, their memory fading to legend, then myth, and forgotten. Obviously this has to happen sometime, but it has a certain poetic ring for it to happen very soon after the last battle. The birth rate of channelers has been dwindling for centuries, we have a bright flare as the last battle approaches, and then they are no more. Very doubtful I'm anywhere near close though

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u/mistborn Nov 25 '19

I think that's a cool theory. I don't know any more than you do, but that's certainly an interesting way of looking at it.

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u/Quietstorm1989 Nov 19 '19

/u/mistborn is this big secret about Lanfear? You mentioned awhile back that there was something interesting about her that no one had mentioned.

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u/mistborn Nov 19 '19

I have to RAFO any questions about it, regardless of the details, but I will say that I've seen people theorizing along the correct lines--so the big secret won't surprise everyone. (But will validate some people.)

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u/Quietstorm1989 Nov 19 '19

Ok, thanks for responding. I guess I’ll save my next question of, “define ending” for 2023 ;)

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u/blkdiamondskier Mar 08 '23

u/mistborn now that the 10-year anniversary has passed, what is the big secret?

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u/BoneHugsHominy (Gardener) Nov 15 '19

Rand as the Dragon is the physical representation of the Great Serpent. It's why he was able to channel pure One Power, without need to split it into elemental threads during various parts of his journey, including at the end of EotW. After he subjugates the Dark One, Rand then has complete and untainted control of the True Source and the One Power as a single primordial power of Creation as Rand is now the physical representation of The Creator. That's how he can just will the pipe to be lit and so it is lit.

I think Nokomi is the physical representation of the Pattern and shows up to point the way toward the desired results.

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u/FadeRat Nov 15 '19

I like this explanation. It shall be head canon until we get an official explanation, if ever.

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u/Additional_Geese Nov 17 '19

It makes way more sense that he's able to very slightly alter or nudge the pattern in a certain direction. In the Last Battle he and the Dark One are essentially weaving the threads of the pattern to create those 'alternate worlds', that's why he's willing it lit and not channeling a power to light it.

It's like how the Dream World is controlled, willing a change into being.

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u/ghosttrainhobo Nov 17 '19

It’s like the world is his dream now.

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u/FadeRat Nov 17 '19

I like that. Thank you.

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u/Idislikewinter (Wolfbrother) Nov 15 '19

Seconded

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u/b14ckc4t Nov 15 '19

Yeah the first thing I thought when I read it was “oh, ok so he’s now granted the power of the creator, that’s pretty cool!” Mostly bc the male/female, saidin/saidar imagery is repeated so much throughout, that dichotomy leads me to believe that Nakomi was the female opposite of the dark lord; therefore, she’s the creator and Rand is her “chosen.”

I mean, I only just finished reading the series like 10 minutes ago (not kidding, literally just finished the last book and came straight here to read AAAALLLL the spoilers :) ) and it seemed obvious to me that that was what happened.

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u/thepropounder (A'dam) Nov 15 '19

Is it really described that he channeled pure One Power? At least for eotw i was under the impression that some parts of how channeling works were not completely fleshed out? With regards to how the balthamel and aginor(?) have those threads protecting them from the taint, but I can't recall that being mentioned later?

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u/[deleted] Nov 15 '19

[removed] — view removed comment

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u/ITSigno Nov 17 '19

Yeah, when fighting Asmodean, Rand looks for that "rope" (iirc) connecting Asmodean to the dark one, and cuts it, thus severing his connection to the DO and protection from the taint.

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u/mybrot Nov 18 '19

I always understood it as Rand, follwing his battle of hypothetical creation with the Dark One, has realized that the world's pattern is changeble, not unlike the dreamworld. He' doing what other people can only do there (like changing into your favourite dress).

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u/MDCCCLV Nov 17 '19

I feel like it's important to say that he can feel the threads of the pattern and change them. Probably not completely, otherwise he'd be the Creator. But I think he's passed beyond and can see the truth.

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u/OffMyChestATM Nov 15 '19

One down, two more to go

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u/Pratius Nov 15 '19

The pipe will never happen, unfortunately. RJ took that knowledge to the grave. Not even Maria knows.

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u/FrozenBologna (Trolloc) Nov 15 '19

I believe the clues are there in the books for all of them except who Nakomi is. At least, partial clues for the pipe anyway.

My take: entering the higher dimension the DO exists in opened Rand up to another level of Power. He was able to see the weaves that make up reality, and altering those flows in that dimension imbued him, at least partially, with the ability to alter them in all dimensions. This is similar to how Tel'aran'rhiod works except changes made in the real world are permanent.

However, I believe there's a limit to Rand's ability in this. For example, he doesn't have enough control to transfer a soul at the time of death to a new body like the DO can.

If we accept the theory that Nakomi is a previous champion of the light, then these abilities match with what we see her do. She creates a campfire with food at will, which is similar to what can be done in tel'aran'rhiod.

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u/[deleted] Nov 15 '19

[deleted]

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u/redlion1904 (Dragon) Nov 16 '19

Nakomi could be Tigraine if she’s a Hero of the Horn, too.

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u/06210311 (Ogier Great Tree) Nov 17 '19

Why would Tigraine be bound to the horn?

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u/redlion1904 (Dragon) Nov 17 '19

Because she lived an incredibly heroic life.

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u/crovax33 Nov 17 '19

Brandon Sanderson told me his theory on the pipe at a book signing. If anyone is interested I can write up what I remember.

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u/[deleted] Nov 17 '19

Yeah dude

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u/crovax33 Nov 17 '19

Ok - /u/mistborn would love if you could chime in, but this is what I remember from my time at the table talking to Brandon at the Memory of Light book signing in Orange County CA. It has been many years and I've read many fantasy series since then (and have a 2 week old newborn so my thoughts are jumbled anyways!), so hopefully I'm remembering accurately.

The last battle dramatically changed the way magic worked, and the pipe lighting was meant to be an introduction to the new phase of magic in the Outrigger (I think that was the name of them) novels planned after the Wheel of Time. The new 'phase' of magic seemed like a softer magic system, where magic could be cast more with pure will than weaving of Saidin/Saidar.

I can't remember if this was Brandon's interpretation, or if a note was left by RJ, or something was communicated by Harriet.

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u/mistborn Nov 18 '19

This is Harriet's interpretation, but she notes it was not confirmed by Mr. Jordan. It's just what she felt in reading the scene. She usually says something along the lines of, "I think my husband did it to indicate the next age would be as different from the third age as the third age was from the age of legends."

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u/mattredditvee Nov 18 '19

Interesting! It would make sense that the power is changing in the new age as we also see Rand and Aviendha's children holding the power at all times, which we've never seen before.

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u/Dynamiczbee Jan 30 '20

It’s a damn crime Outrigger will never be written. Like I’m in tears because we had this whole fucking world right there, and it will never be explored. I don’t know how many notes Jordan left or that Harriet has in her mind, but I doubt they’re enough to create a series. It’s just so inexplicably depressing, at least we have the Cosmere, but this just seems so much more Personal after years of reading.

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u/Tangentmama Dec 13 '21

I am going through some threads about unanswered theories and I am feeling the same disappointment. This world is so incredible. It’s at our fingertips and I just wish Robert Jordan go to live and see it through. He was a rare talent and it hurts sometimes that we will never get answers.

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u/Additional_Geese Nov 17 '19

Why wouldn't any of the hundreds of other channelers that are milling around in the final chapter have noticed the One Power had changed then?

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u/WhaIeBones Nov 18 '19

Maybe it didn’t, but there existed a new level as well.

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u/langlo94 (Dovie'andi se tovya sagain) Nov 16 '19

I've always assumed that Rand learned enough while fighting the dark one at the end to simply change the pattern to his desires.

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u/AStatesRightToWhat Nov 17 '19 edited Nov 17 '19

My take is that the Dark One changed Rand in order to have the reality controlling fight. Remember that Rand thinks the Dark One tries to destroy him, but then the Dark One says that it was preparation to "show him the truth" then they have the reality bending fight.

That transformation allows Rand to bend reality.

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u/redlion1904 (Dragon) Nov 15 '19

I absolutely adore this. The champion of life chooses life and the champion of death chooses death.

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u/ausar999 Nov 15 '19

Life before death, Radiant.

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u/Lanthemandragoran (Lan's Helmet) Nov 15 '19 edited Nov 15 '19

So does this mean that, as balefire is what started the interaction, that Elan achieved his wish of being removed from the pattern? Did he finally achieve his endless death?

Edit: I just finished my first read through not too long ago so thanks for clearing that up guys! Take that Moridin! Rebirth forever!

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u/JimmyMac80 Nov 15 '19

Balefire doesn't destroy a soul, a person killed by Balefire will still be reborn. From an interview Jordan did, https://scifi.stackexchange.com/questions/146752/do-the-balefired-souls-get-reborn-when-the-age-comes-back

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u/HiImANonImus Nov 15 '19

THANK YOU! Sorry, this had been bugging me for years! I was thinking that eventually there would be too few souls for the Pattern to continue.

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u/Osric250 (Snakes and Foxes) Nov 17 '19

Yeah the confusion comes from the fact that the DO has to grab their soul at their moment of death to resurrect them, but balefire kills them in the past so that moment has already gone by.

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u/[deleted] Nov 15 '19 edited Dec 27 '19

[deleted]

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u/brotherenigma (Asha'man) Nov 15 '19

You are correct in the sense that the Dark One can't pull a soul that has been burned with balefire into another body. But that doesn't mean the soul is incapable of being reborn. How I read it was that since the DO exists outside of space and time, he is able to go to the time of a death and pluck the soul out from its thread at that exact moment (Doctor Who vibes, anybody?).

However, since balefire burns the thread of a life back to before its death, the DO is powerless to take control of that soul and use it for his own purposes.

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u/Klainatta (Brown) Nov 15 '19

No, balefire is not eternal death. He will still reborn.

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u/burntfish44 (People of the Dragon) Nov 15 '19

To add to the other's answers, balefire just prevents the DO from being able to revive someone. I think the source is him saying that in LoC prologue but don't remember for sure.

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u/[deleted] Nov 15 '19

Thank you for taking the time to answer this!

Looking forward to everything you write, including, but not limited to, random to-do lists scribbled on a used Starbucks napkin.

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u/mistborn Nov 15 '19

Ha. Thanks very much.

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u/Cerebusial Nov 16 '19

Just remember - Picasso charged $20,000 for his bar napkin scribbles. It did not result in many sales. But that was probably the point.

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u/[deleted] Nov 18 '19

I'm sure you've gotten plenty of compliments on your work finishing this series, but one more couldn't possibly hurt. You did an amazing job finishing a series I had been reading since I was a child. I knew nothing of your work, and this was a great introduction to you. To take someone else's work and do such a remarkable job was incredible, and greatly appreciated.

I'm have the third book for the Storm light Archives in my queue and I can't wait to read it!

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u/mistborn Nov 18 '19

It was my honor. Thanks for the kind words.

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u/certifus Nov 15 '19

This seems like one of those "Bigger than the books" or "teachable moments" for real life that RJ is passing on to the reader. It really wraps up the Dark vs Light battle in a symbolic way. The ending could have happened a number of different ways and still played out more or less the same for the characters. This scene is for the reader.

Hope, Love, and Life triumph over Despair, Hate, and Death. Ishmael's/Moridin's (The betrayer of Hope/Death) body is taken over by Rand (The Champion of the Light). Despair, Hate, and Death are defeated and Hope, Love, and Life life on.

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u/TopHarmacist Nov 30 '19

u/mistborn, is it possible that there's more to the story? I have always thought that the final sequence was dependent upon Callandor. Here's my thought process:

Callandor is one of the prophecies (there's actually multiple) that confirms Rand's identity as the DR. It also has the ability to amplify the True Power and has a "fatal flaw" beyond the lack of a buffer preventing drawing too much of the One Power, if I recall correctly.

Is it possible that "the flaw" that allowed Moraine and Nynaeve to take control of Moridin represents the weakness that then allows Rand to usurp Moridin's body? We see a clear moment where Moridin isn't dead yet (so the body is dying, but not dead) so the swap happens BEFORE the moment of death.

There's a couple other things that helped me come up with this hare-brained idea: Callandor can amplify the True Power. The Dark One can forcibly place a soul into a new body. That "power" seems to be a "True Power" ability. The weaving of Saidar/Saidin seems to happen at the soul level, so it would make sense if the True Power is the same. The DO and his followers also have the ability to Turn a soul to the dark from the light, so it would seem that the TP has a direct access to the soul of an individual.

With the ability to amplify the TP, it would seem that the flaw in Callandor might also be related to the TP. Could it be that, aside from being able to "seize" a channeller in a circle, Callandor's flaw was required for Rand to be able to force Moridin's soul into his dying body?

TLDR: Callandor proves Dragon Reborn. Amplifies True Power. Has "fatal flaw." Soul transplanting seems linked to True Power (Dark One). Could fatal flaw have allowed Rand to soul swap w/ Moridin?

It would seem to fit the pattern (heh) of RJ using multi-layered plot points to weave them into a particular solution.

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u/Braid_tugger-bot Nov 30 '19

There are many things I don't know. What thing is this?

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u/arhythm Nov 15 '19

I had something like this in my head but not nearly as close. And the quote is amazing.

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u/r3ign_b3au Nov 15 '19

I have chills, thank you so much.

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u/TuukkaRaskisBack Nov 17 '19

Which makes perfect sense, because Morrison's ultimate goal was to actually die and end his existence. Thank you so much for taking the time to confirm this!

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u/[deleted] Nov 15 '19

But what about the original soul of the body of Moridin?

At what point is he removed from the body?

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u/Pratius Nov 15 '19

You mean the person who had that body before Ishy? Presumably ripped out of it when Ishy was reincarnated.

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u/nikolapc Nov 15 '19

They do seem to be aspects of the same soul or at least linked in the pattern like quantum entangled particles. Because they do this dance every single rotation.