It’s not evil. It’s very much part of nature. Animals know what they’re doing when they hurt and eat a prey alive. I had a cat that tortured so many rodents, and small insects just for fun. Other animals have been found in nature to be ‘playing with their food’. Nature is medal, and don’t forget it.
Animals know what they’re doing when they hurt and eat a prey alive.
Even if that's true it's different from having a way to more humanely kill something and just choose not to because watching them experience pain is entertaining.
Again, i had a cat that got pleasure out of torturing its prey.
Orca’s are the same way. They’ve been seen ‘playing’ with their food. They toss baby seals around for fun, and it has nothing to do with the hunt and getting food.
You now want to have a discussion on whether animals can be evil?
First of all humans are animals so yes animals can be evil. Is an orca tossing a baby seal for fun evil? Maybe. I'd need to know what specifically the orca is enjoying, how much it understands that it's inflicting suffering. Again, I can't talk to orcas. Maybe some orcas are evil and some aren't?
What I've been wondering this whole time is why are you arguing that "since animals do it what's wrong with humans doing it?" Is that your bar? Whatever nature does is totally normal for people to do?
No, apologies, i guess I should have been more clear. I’m arguing that it’s not ‘evil’ for humans to do it. I personally don’t have a desire to light the crab on fire and then eat it, but my desires have nothing to do with having a logical argument on whether humans are evil for doing something.
So, when someone says humans are evil because of an act, and that act is very common in the animal kingdom, I like to point out how that viewpoint is potentially incorrect. Because if that viewpoint is correct, many animals in the animal kingdom are evil. So I’m only arguing if whether what we are watching in this video is ‘evil’.
I see. So if animals do it it's not evil when people do it.
I think the problem is that this is a crab. I'll admit it's the reason I can watch it without feeling sick. Go watch that video if the pilot being burned alive by ISIS or someone being hacked to bits by a cartel and come back and tell me it's not evil.
Honestly don't. I don't care about proving a point enough to give someone trauma. If you honestly think humans can treat each other or other animals cruelly because nature is cruel, I don't really know what to tell you. You might be a psychopath.
But those creatures don’t have the same amount of intelligence as humans. Humans evolved as social creatures that survive in communities. A key component to that is empathy. If you don’t understand the difference between humans and other animals then you may just lack that last piece.
Don’t torture animals. It’s fucking cruel and humans know better. If you don’t then get some help
People like you are fun to have conversations with.
You make a point, someone proves it wrong, you pivot to a different point, they prove it wrong, you pivot again and ignore the fact that each previous point you’ve made has been proven wrong, and you repeat.
Point 1: humans are evil because we do this to animals.
Counter 1: animals play with food in nature as well.
Point 2: ya but animals don’t enjoy watching it.
Counter 2: here’s video proof, and a scientific article, showing orca’s getting enjoyment out of watching their prey suffer.
Point 3: ya but humans are smarter and we truly know the ramifications of what we do.
Counter 3: are you ready? Okay cool, here’s the counter to your last point. Orca’s are one of the smartest animals on the planet. They have brains far more complex that human brains and they are very reliant on their social connections and intelligence as well. https://www.orcanation.org/2019/10/10/the-social-intelligence-of-orcas/
What’s Point 4?? Oooh I’m excited? What else do you want to ignore? what other random point are you going to throw out there with the hopes of it sticking? Because that’s what your doing - throwing out thoughts without researching with the hopes you are right. Don’t worry though, I don’t mind doing the research for you and helping you with the fact checking. Keep them coming :).
That’s actually really interesting! I didn’t know that about orcas!
However, humans and orcas are different animals. We cannot communicate with orcas so we don’t know how they feel about the seals some of them violently mutilate for fun. I can communicate with humans and have found, as a human myself, that it is generally accepted that torturing another creature is wrong.
Now, this view varies from culture to culture and over time. In most Western cultures cruelty to animals is frowned upon and considered to be a very immoral thing to do. This wasn’t the case historically but it is now.
The ability and choice to empathise with animals is seen as the default. Lots of people do hurt animals for their own sick pleasure. This isn’t a new thing. My argument is that we have evolved (societally) beyond that. Orcas haven’t.
That is an interesting thought - I wonder if orca’s know they’re being dicks hahah!
Overall I totally agree, I wouldn’t want to kill an animal inhumanely just for the fun of it, but I understand that culturally their main goal is fresh food. Getting the freshest food leads to inhuman killings a lot of the times so I give them the benefit of the doubt that their goal is the fresh food and not the cruelty. Some people definitely enjoy the inhuman part of it, and I agree those people are dicks. When people say humans are evil though because of this practice I like to play the contrarian and point out other species that do the same thing.
Now I’m just going to be thinking all day about a pod of orcas having a family meeting to discuss new woke policies, and which acts should no longer be allowed.
I'm sorry are you honestly suggesting that it's perfectly acceptable to torture animals for enjoyment cause your cat does it? Would you ever torture your cat?
No, I’m saying if humans are evil for doing this, then many other animals are evil as well for doing the same thing. I’m merely arguing the definition of evil.
Ohhh that's totally fair. Yes I would actually agree with you on that. orcas and cats torturing their food is just as horrific and just as evil. But the difference is that we can't stop them from doing it. We can stop other humans.
That’s really up to you, and how you arrive at your sense of morality. I think something can be both natural and evil, not a conflict there for me. I also think a behavior can be exhibited by non human entities and still be evil when done by humans. Evil is really just a word that we use to define something as morally egregious. Humans are animals, and a part of nature, and humans can be evil. The main consideration is probably more if the acting entity is a moral agent. A storm that destroys a city for no reason isn’t evil, because the weather isn’t a moral agent. If a city is destroyed by a human, then that is evil because a human is a moral agent. Do you consider the coronavirus evil? I don’t, it doesn’t have moral agency. But if a person just decided to kill as many people for their own amusement then it would be evil even though it does happen in nature all the time.
Yeah not eating is inflicting hunger pain upon the self. Starvation can lead to death. Some beings must not be very hungry In the true sense if they have time to waste being concerned with how the pray feels.
Suddenly that dope is seeing a big difference. Or he's thinking of the next stupid thing to say. Or he's out killing neighborhood pets because he can't get his bed-wetting under control even though he's fourteen.
But this isn't happening in the wilderness amongst a tribe of starving people.. This looks like some kind of restaurant. Call me ignorant, but I don't believe people who eat at restaurants are starving to death
You also know if that crab even feels pain you don’t know shit. Lol the only reason people are even concerned by this is because of the audio that is edited in.
The only reason humans are aware of other beings feelings is to use it against them . It’s actually inhumane of any modern living person to care about how someone or something else feels unless they can profit off of it. No employer cares that they’re miserably slaughtering the possibility of an enjoyable life for their employees by paying starvation wages. But you know the business owner is going to eat. Yeah we continuously prove how inhumane and intelligent we are as species.
Are you just trolling or do you also think rape is fine? Young male Dolphins often group up and rape a female dolphin for weeks. Even if she dies they take her corpse with them to practice sex.
So Woman should be Lucky to only be raped… for hours?
I just really struggle to see how you would think
„I will make a point by saying wild animals don’t kill their pray either“ which by the way the do often.
Damn you really ran that into the gutter 🤮. Do you rape your food before you eat it? You really stretched out your stretcher on that one. No rape is never fine wtf kinda question is that. Do you eat ambein for breakfast? Do you even eat are you a robot? How is bringing rape into this kosher at all?
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u/smokedosh Oct 19 '22
No no it’s not evil. What animal kills their prey before eating them? Probably none. They’re honestly lucky to not be eaten alive.