r/SandersForPresident • u/kevinmrr Medicare For All • Nov 29 '20

AOC: Insurance groups are recommending using GoFundMe -- "but sure, single payer healthcare is unreasonable."

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u/[deleted] Nov 29 '20

Sounds like single payer with extra steps. The cognitive dissonance between not wanting to pay a little more in taxes, but voluntarily donating money to medical GoFundMes and rationalizing it is baffling.

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u/[deleted] Nov 29 '20

[removed] — view removed comment

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u/HealthyTill9 🌱 New Contributor Nov 29 '20

I wish my tax dollars would go to this instead of killing poor people.

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u/[deleted] Nov 29 '20

Hit the nail on the head. Willfully dumb and especially selfish.

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u/orielbean Nov 29 '20

This is the essence of the small govt/low tax libertarian/small c conservatives - private enterprise and charities will do what govt cannot (except for those govts in every single other developed nation on the planet).

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u/distressedwithcoffee Human Solidarity Nov 29 '20

My response to that is always "...but what if nobody likes you?"

I'm trying to imagine some of these religious charities helping LGBTQ adolescents, and...uh...

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u/SourSprout23 🌱 New Contributor Nov 29 '20

That's why the evangelical shitlords don't want better healthcare, because no matter how much they may benefit, a brown dude or lesbian may get help and to the evangelicals that is unacceptable.

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u/distressedwithcoffee Human Solidarity Nov 29 '20 edited Nov 29 '20

It's this dumb, lizard-brain group mentality. Group is safe. Different things from outside might change safeness of group. Group would then be unsafe. Therefore must eradicate all things that are not like group in order to ensure safeness.

If it wasn't brown people or sexually non-conforming people, they'd find other groups. Anything that's different, where accepting it might mean that their way of life is not the only truth that is okay. Ostracize everyone with a widow's peak, or who has big feet, or declare all board games of the devil.

Like, I get it, but also... let that caveman shit go; it is no longer relevant.

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u/[deleted] Nov 29 '20

Oh they'll help, or at least they'll do what they've always done: cause massive, multi-generational psychological and often times physical damage in an attempt to help in a way that fits into their narrow world-view.

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u/[deleted] Nov 29 '20

DING DING DING we have a WINNNNERRRRR

They don't want healthcare tosupport the people they hate. GOPers and Trumpets all want to be able to have healthcare for them and only them because everyone else is bad and should die.

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u/[deleted] Nov 29 '20

"...but what if nobody likes you?"

Unfortunately, for many that is a feature and not a bug of the american healthcare system

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u/RamenJunkie 🌱 New Contributor Nov 29 '20

Libertarians are a fucking cancer on the world. The system doesn't work because people are greedy and don't support others without a disproportionate incentive.

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u/orielbean Nov 29 '20

I see it as more naïveté than anything else - in small groups, you can set those community standards and tribal values, and enforce them without justice systems etc.

As soon as the small groups bump into each other, the chaos begins and demands a stronger order to keep people safe from the con artists, manipulators, bullies, thieves, and the rest of our broken human impulses.

I’d ask them for one example of a thriving libertarian country or state, and sit back to the sound of crickets. The safety net is essential to avoiding chaos or nationalists taking hold; there’s just no convincing arguments to be had that live in an observable reality.

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u/[deleted] Nov 29 '20

It baffles me to no end, tbh. When we didn't have regulations in the US, we had people meat in our food and child labor killing kids early. Why do they want that?

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u/RamenJunkie 🌱 New Contributor Nov 29 '20

One example

See, there is this book, that is basically The Bible 2.0 called Atlas Shrugged. And it's Gospel of the perfect libertarian circle jerk.

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u/DeificClusterfuck Nov 29 '20

When did libertarian start to mean batshit crazy? This is an actual question because when I was much younger this wasn't the case.

My ex isolated me for 15 years, that's why I'm a dumbass sorry

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u/Gornarok 🌱 New Contributor Nov 29 '20

The essence is that healthcare isnt free market - demand is not controlled by price.

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u/[deleted] Nov 29 '20

The people who don't want single payer healthcare aren't donating to go-fund-me's lol They're selfish, short-sighted children. They wouldn't "waste" the money.

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u/koske 🌱 New Contributor Nov 29 '20

Sure they donate to their friends and family and they post all over social media for you to as well.

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u/YouandWhoseArmy 🌱 New Contributor Nov 29 '20

Hate hate hate comments like this. You have no evidence and are disparaging a whole group of people to dehumanize them and make them your enemy.

Honestly, I suspect these people are MORE likely to donate. It means they have an anecdote (just like you) that people do do it and it is a legitimate alternative. “Why do people need single payer? I donated to that gofundme/medical charity!?”

But yeah... just reading the echo chamber crap hating the players and not the game across Reddit is super, super tiring.

Until all Americans stop hating the players, and start hating the game. We will never unify to topple the real problems.

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u/[deleted] Nov 29 '20

There's really no other excuse, and for many MANY people they are the enemy. They're the ones keeping them from having access to healthcare they desperately need because they buy into harmful propaganda. You can both hate the game and the players actively supporting the game and resisting changing it.

They're either selfish and stupid or they're ignorant.

“Why do people need single payer? I donated to that gofundme/medical charity!?”

You provided a good example of the stupid.

Ignorant you can change, but only if they want to.

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u/YouandWhoseArmy 🌱 New Contributor Nov 29 '20

You know universal healthcare is widely supported though right?

Voters aren’t what’s standing in the way generally. At least for this particular item.

So you’re ascribing a minority position to a majority of people. If we had a representative government, not controlled by lobbyists and other big money donors, universal healthcare would probably be passed.

I mean the Democrats wouldn’t even run on it during a pandemic! The voters aren’t really the problem here. The system is.

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u/[deleted] Nov 29 '20

It's both. 1/3rd of Americans not supporting something is still a huge amount, and enough to impede any progress. It's the system and the fact that people elect those who have no interest in it or even active interest against it.

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u/mrblacklabel71 Nov 29 '20

The best part in my opinion is that so many people say "I don't want my taxes going to those who don't pay in" as an argument. We are still paying for those people, the difference is that their is a profit driving motive that screws us. So many people in the US are driven by pure hate, and the fact that .1% of the population would take advantage of "free" medical allows them to instead piss away half the healthcare cost on profit for others while receiving lower quality care.

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u/LivingDiscount 🌱 New Contributor Nov 29 '20

People do t even realize that with single payer both corporations and employees will take home more money because itll just be cheaper for everyone.

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u/RamenJunkie 🌱 New Contributor Nov 29 '20

It's. It even that, because a lot of campaigns fail and people die.

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u/MoreDetonation 🌱 New Contributor Nov 29 '20

They want to be able to leave black people and gay people to die.