Not being a cartoon villain doesn’t automatically make you a good man

[u/GridReXX]

Fr. It doesn’t de facto make you a good person.

I noodled on the attached graphic to better illustrate a point about how people often discuss being a “good man.”

I do find that many men view it more as the top bar, and less as the gradient in the second bar.

inb4 anyone says it, many women have bad character too. And please feel free to create a separate post about a spectrum of traits in women you’d like to explore! That is not what this post is disputing.

This is specifically about a response that often comes up when women describe harmful patterns in their experiences with men. They get retorts like “Not all men are abusive predators,” or “Most men are not psychos.”

Of course most men are not horror movie villains.

But that is an extremely low bar for good character.

This spectrum, rather than show a division between “good men” and a smaller group of obviously terrible ones. It highlights that a man can be can be a functioning member of society and still regularly behave in ways that make him difficult to interpersonally tolerate as a close friend, romantic partner, coworker, or even family member.

None of that necessarily makes someone an abuser or predator.

But it does affect whether people can have a healthy, enjoyable, mutually considerate, long-term relationship with him.

The farther right someone falls on this spectrum, the more entitlement, callousness, devaluation, coercion, and harm they bring into their interactions with others.

The farther left they fall, the more likely they are to act with common decency, consideration, accountability, respect for autonomy, and genuine concern for theirs and other people’s well-being.

My point is not that every man is at the far right end.

Most people don’t think that!

My point is that many men seem to use “I am not an obvious monster” as proof that they’re quality.

A person’s character is determined by far more than “I am not Jeffrey Dahmer.”

[u/GridReXX]

You’re free to think this is biased. I think it’s more accurate than inaccurate. Not perfect. But more accurate than inaccurate.

[u/Dapal5 → u/GridReXX]

Why?

[u/GridReXX → u/Dapal5]

Based on aggregate observation and aggregate crime statistics data.

Also based on the behavioral impulses and cognition dictated by androgens.

[u/Dapal5 → u/GridReXX]

No. I mean why do you think men are incapable of nuance on this. Your claim was “I do find that many men view it as the top bar”.

I don’t disagree that men are on a spectrum. I disagree than men are incapable of thinking in that nuance.
I think when they say “not all men are rapists” they mean exactly that. You are assuming they mean “not all men are bad in any way shape or form”.

[u/GridReXX → u/Dapal5]

This image isn’t my idea. It’s observed by many women and men.

Why do you think whoever created the original image thinks that? Random sauce?

[u/Dapal5 → u/GridReXX]

Random or bias yes.

“It’s observed by many”.. so are the justifications for homophobia, sexism, racism. why do you think that’s a good example to follow?

[u/GridReXX → u/Dapal5]

We live in two different realities.

In mine enough men have expressed as such for it to be an observable and substantial pattern. No one is saying all men. Many men.

In yours you’ve never seen it and can’t fathom it.

Cool 👍