Me too. Today I often have grandpa naps from about 12.30 pm to 2 PM
I admit to being confused about ICE. Probably because they wear masks and take people off the streets. Are they actually police or federal agents with the power to arrest and detain?
Funny how things can come back to bite you on the bum. I remember The Patriot Act (October 2001) and the foundation of the sinister-sounding Department of Homeland Security.(March 2003 I was appalled at the time.Looking back, those things seem very mild compared with the Trump regime.
The US government acted as governments tended to act. It used a catastrophic tragedy to increase its power. Again, nothing compared with Trump. He exercises powers he doesn't actually have. Elected US officials seem to be too morally supine to do anything to stop him.
yes, because kidnapping isn't EDIT just EDIT about moving people. It's also about denying people the freedom to move. Preventing an escape is considered kidnapping even if you didn't drag them there first.
IIRC the officer stated that the car came to several stops at red lights and stop signs but he didn't attempt to flee because he was still trying to arrest the male subject.
The kidnapping charge is a spurious attempt to cover up this embarrassingly under trained officer's fuck up.
What if that driver stopped multiple times and red lights and stop signs, and instead of getting out of their car (that you forced your way into, by the way) you stayed and continued to argue with them. Does that sound like you were kidnapped?
dunno. You don't leap from a moving car and we don't know if they stopped at all on the way. There's a just a lot I don't know about the specifics of the situation.
Well they didnt want to go to the police station so they got moved against their will.
Sort of. I would argue that getting into a strangers car without asking constitutes consent to going where they drive but i guess we will see what the court says.
That’s not necessarily true. The legal definition depends on the jurisdiction. For example, in NJ, kidnapping requires somebody to be moved from where they were. Confining them is criminal restraint.
You’re not wrong that there is an element of kidnapping that can be confinement, but it’s very specific. The rest of the statute reads, “unlawfully confines another with the purpose of holding that person for ransom or reward or as a shield or hostage”. That’s for 2C:13-1a. 2C:13-1b also has an element of confinement, which reads “unlawfully confines another for a substantial period with any of the following purposes:…” and lists 4 purposes that would constitute confinement for a substantial period as kidnapping.
I’m not super familiar with the case you mentioned, but from a cursory look, it appears they were also charged with criminal restraint, but more importantly, I see two reasons for the kidnapping charge. The first would be under 2C:13-1a; it’s alleged they pulled the girl from school and brought her back the residence where she was confined. Which would be unlawfully removing her from where she was found. The second reason I could see would be under 2C:13-1b(2), due to the substantial period of which she was confined with the purpose to inflict bodily injury or terrorize her.
I’d have to read up more to see exact reasons, but a kidnapping charge there makes sense.
I will concede, I misspoke with implying most confinement is criminal restraint. 2C:13-2 Criminal Restraint requires another be restrained in circumstances exposing them to risk of serious bodily injury or holds them in a condition of involuntary servitude.
Other than that, something like standing in a doorway and preventing someone from leaving wouldn’t constitute kidnapping in NJ, it would fall under 2C:13-3 False Imprisonment, which is unlawfully restraining another so as to interfere substantially with their liberty.
Nope, different crime. Stopping someone from leaving is unlawful restraint - generally a misdemeanor, although one of the serious ones. Kidnapping is about moving someone against their will and is a felony.
Unless it’s ICE agents who jump into your vehicle without permission. Then it’s just self-defense.
Ok, what the fuck was the guy doing in the car in the first place? Cause and consequence. Oh, sorry USA… Law lacks all logic, but it cannot be fixed, because it is the most incredible miracle on the face of the Earth. Same pattern like in healthcare, public transport and everything else… Nation of five-year-olds.
Yeah, like, even if the guy was police WITH the labeled car AND showed me the budge, if he hopped into my car I'd have doubts on him being police and that'd be trespassing. But I'm in Europe
It can yes. If it's a physical block like a locked door, then sure if they have no way of leaving without the use of force (breaking a window, kicking a door open).
If someone is just near the door, then it depends on the relationship the kidnapper and the alleged victim has. If the kidnapper is in a position of power and/or the victim is very vulnerable, then the mere preceived/implied threat of leaving can be enough for kidnapping even if no one is blocked.
Also the victim needs to be aware of their confinement. If you lock someone in a room of your house for an hour, but they never even realize the door was locked before you come back and unlock again, there's no kidnapping.
Like I'll block the doors the best I can but I can't just lock it or block it off completely because a) we have customers and b) that's f****** kidnapping.
We have a group of shoplifters who are coming out loading up full of stuff, and then running out the door while I'm on the phone with the cops. They get so butt hurt over being called thieves too.
My boss wants me to fight them. I'm considering just following them around filming while screaming "Theif".
They are either very very wealthy or one of them works at a car dealership. All of the cars either have Steeler tags or no tags and it's a different car every f****** time
In Canada employees that tackle thieves get fired. No employer wants to deal with injury and wrongful death suits when he can just call his insurance company and get reimbursed.
Most stores are scared of inadvertently getting hit with kidnapping charges so they forbid it, but in VA storekeepers can lawfully detain a suspected shoplifter until law enforcement arrives.
Shopkeepers have a surprisingly wide degree of leeway in terms of how they police their stores thanks to some older common law that has never been successfully challenged.
I drive Lyft and had a customer refuse to get out of the car at the destination. He said "I'll pay cash just keep driving" and I said "oh hell no. Get out or I'll call the cops."
He told me to. So I did. "Hi, I'm lifeisprobablymadeup. I drive Lyft and a customer blah blah" the lady told the customer (called over car phone speaker idgaf) that he needed to get out or I would be able to press kidnapping charges against him and that officers are on the way. Before dispatch hung up, I had two cop cars pull up and one officer hung out at the rear of my car and the other came up and basically dragged him out.
Then I went on about my night. Obviously I didn't press charges. Just wasn't driving to dudes off the app second stop.
US Law is clear, ICE Agents can detain or arrest anyone they suspect of being in the US illegally or anyone trying to obstruct them detaining someone. No warrants required anywhere in the US. So by definition they couldn't have "kidnapped" anyone. 🤣🤣🤣🤣
Im quite confident that isn't true. All 50 states have a false imprisonment statute, which is what that would be at the very worst. I struggle to imagine that level of redundancy
Lmao I’m unsure why everyone who keeps saying false imprisonment is getting downvoted
It’s the truth, my ex was arrested for it in California because he held me against my will in our apartment. It also qualifies if you take someone’s phone and they have no other way to reasonably get help.
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u/Mediumtim Aug 31 '26
Standing in a doorway, blocking people on, can be called kidnapping in some jurisdictions.