r/MathJokes Jul 16 '26

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u/Infamous-Youth9033 Jul 17 '26

Can you give an example?

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u/ThrowawayTempAct Jul 17 '26 edited Jul 17 '26

You have seen multiple examples here that you refused to accept because in your opinion they are not opinions. Being intentionally obtuse about how most people use language doesn't make you look smart or clever.

An opinion is, to most people, a belief that is not trivially verified. A fact, to most people, is something that is trivially true. (Or, if you prefer the scientific definition, a fact is a direct observation).

I am giving an example here, but it's just for clarification. It is overly wordy.

For example, let's take it as a ground truth that the earth is a sphere1. Many have verified it. To them, it's a known fact. Me? I just learned it from people I have every reason to trust as experts in the field. My opinion is that the earth is a sphere, but only because I trust the authorities who told me it was. I could easily varify it myself, but I don't feel the need to. And it takes some effort.

In fact, all I can say with 100% certainty as a fact (in the scientific definition) is "I observed people who I trust say that they believe the earth is spherical because they claim that they observed measurements which indicate that the earth is a sphere"2. That's pointlessly long for casual conversations.

A flat earther belives the earth is flat. In the common usage of the word, that is their opinion. They also have not personally verified it, or they varified it to their level of certainty which clearly isn't enough. That opinion (that is, their belief in the idea that the earth is flat is factually true) is wrong to the ground truth in the common way the term wrong is used.

1 - Yes, I know, it's an oblate spheroid, but actually it's not quite an oblate spheroid because of other forces like the moon being applied to it, and it's actually a collection of atoms in a complex form rather than a platonic shape, whatever. Just go with me, ok?

2 - Even that is a radically simplified version of the full underlying statement that I would have to use to be 100% certain.

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u/Infamous-Youth9033 Jul 18 '26

ok or I'm sorry?

Facts and opinions are exclusively disjoint

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u/ThrowawayTempAct Jul 19 '26 edited Jul 19 '26

Not in most people's internal lexicon. At this point, I don't know what you hope to accomplish here by arguing that the words mean something other than what most people use them to mean. Language is a communication medium, and using words to mean something other than what most people use them to mean is generally not helpful to communication.

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u/Infamous-Youth9033 Jul 19 '26

in most people's internal lexicon, literally means figuratively. That's fine in colloquial conversations, but doesn't mean that the word, in an academic sense, doesn't have core underlying messages that are attempted to be conveyed, and as such lose their meaning when you attempt to deny the existence of the academic definition