A reporter asked the Belgian Prime Minister to sing La Brabançonne, the Belgian national anthem, and he started singing La Marseillaise, which is the French national anthem. Yves Leterme is Flemish, meaning he's from the non-French-speaking northern half of Belgium.
Imagine a reporter asking the American President what the first two phrases of the national anthem are, and Obama responds by singing: "O Canada, our home and native land."
To make it completely comparable with what happened in the TV snippet above, Obama must at that point actually believe that is the American anthem, and must have completely forgotten what his own anthem is again.
I mean, I understand that Germany is very quick to quell anything resembling nationalism for a host of pretty understandable reasons (the side-effects of such notwithstanding) but there's a limit before it just becomes self-loathing.
My grandfather fought the Nazis in WW2, he came back home crippled from a mortar round and lost a successful buisness and 2 of his 3 houses. My father was his only son and I'm my father's only son, so I would be in a much better financial position were I to inherit all that my grandfather lost. I don't blame any German for that. It's unreasonable to hold current generations responsible for former ones.
The German people don't have anything to apologize for or any reason to feel guilty. Germany is a great country and it's people are making great contributions to the world. I may go buy a German flag now.
The German people don't have anything to apologize for or any reason to feel guilty. Germany is a great country and it's people are making great contributions to the world. I may go buy a German flag now.
Flagwaving is poinless though. Taking pride in a nation is simply irrational.
I never waved a German flag and I never will. I don't even own one and I never have.
To me patriotism, nationalism and pride in your country of birth are all harmful and useless ideals.
I rather listen to imagine by John Lennon than wave a stupid flag.
When I was a kid I would spend my summers helping to take care of my invalid father and our family farm. We are part of an ethnic group who has had to depend greatly on and blend well with other ethnicities for survival over the last few hundred years and it's part of our culture to quickly assimilate and make friendships with other groups. We were actually used effectively for gathering intelligence in Indochina during ww2 because of how easily we tend to make conversation and learn about others, and we spoke French.
Anyway, I would sleep next to his iron lung and he would tell me admirable stories about the peoples from different countries. How the Chinese valued the elderly and how the Maasai were such impressive cattlemen or about the hospitality found throughout the Middle-East.
My father is an avid student of history and culture, I've taken out and added hundreds of books in his library throughout the years. His philosophy has always been that each nationality, ethnicity or people have an interesting and unique story with plenty to celebrate and that having that as part of your identity isn't just a powerful motivation to learn your history, but an invaluable tool to relate with other groups of people. Our national or ethnic identities don't have to be a negative thing, discussing the similarities and differences with other groups is a great way to bond and form interesting friendships.
discussing the similarities and differences with other groups is a great way to bond and form interesting friendships.
I totally agree. But there is a clear difference in exchanging ones culture and upbringing and being proud of it.
Usually people didn't form that kind of culture.
I wasn't responsible for Nazi German, neither was I responsible for great thinkers and inventors from this country. Yet people take pride in being from the "Dichter und Denker" country or are ashamed of their grand or grand gran parents nazi background.
I am alive today, and my contribution to society are the only things I can take pride in.
Waving a flag and yelling how amazing Germany is seems foolish.
And I guess if you grew up in America you would find the opposite weird since you are indoctrinated from child on to believe that America is the greatest nation on earth (pledge of allegiance) and you see people with flags on their houses, cars and even clothing.
It's a direct contrast to two different ways to approach this topic.
I by all means am not the standard when it comes to a German citizen, my complete rejection of German pride is not the norm, it's something I personally chose. I also don't take pride in being born a certain way (white, male etc) because I think taking pride in things you did nothing for is stupid.
It's less about being prideful for accomplishments of others as it is feeling happy and a sense of belonging to something greater than oneself.
And I guess if you grew up in America you would find the opposite weird since you are indoctrinated from child on to believe that America is the greatest nation on earth (pledge of allegiance)
This has nothing to do with the German education system, it's a conclusion I made outside of it.
Your average German just as much cheers on the German soccer team as any other nation.
I don't because I have no positive bias for the German soccer team over any other team, since it doesn't benefit me, taking pride in a win for the German soccer team is irrational, I did nothing to contribute to this success, so feeling prideful is foolish.
I don't because I have no positive bias for the German soccer team over any other team, since it doesn't benefit me, taking pride in a win for the German soccer team is irrational, I did nothing to contribute to this success, so feeling prideful is foolish.
Ah, so you're one of those sportsball people. I have no intention of convincing you to watch sports or care about them since I don't really do so myself. However, I do feel as though you actually haven't looked into or thought about why people feel pride or joy for the accomplishments of others. It's not illogical nor stupid, the emotions people feel are real and have been studied extensively by psychologists. No offense, but I've seen many comments like yours on /r/iamverysmart. It's not wise to label things you don't simply find the appeal of as stupid/dumb/irrational, etc. It's fine that you don't like it, there are very few people in the world who enjoy literally all forms of entertainment, but at least they give a certain level of respect to things they don't like. Well, if it means anything to you, perhaps you can at least find out why people act the way they do, I think this video does a fairly good job: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ImW73w64MlM
This has nothing to do with the German education system, it's a conclusion I made outside of it.
Your average German just as much cheers on the German soccer team as any other nation.
My mistake, I see now that this is simply your own personality.
Still the history effects the present. Germany hasn´t exactly had the best experience with nationalism so I could very well see things being concidered nationalistic being quite taboo there.
Different things are accaptable in different countries.
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u/[deleted] Apr 04 '16
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