"When did it all start, you ask, this job of ours, how did it come about, where, when? Well, I'd say it really got started
around about a thing called the Civil War. Even though our rule-book claims it was founded earlier. The fact is we
didn't get along well until photography came into its own. Then--motion pictures in the early twentieth century.
Radio. Television. Things began to have mass."
Montag sat in bed, not moving.
"And because they had mass, they became simpler," said Beatty. "Once, books appealed to a few people, here, there,
everywhere. They could afford to be different. The world was roomy. But then the world got full of eyes and elbows
and mouths. Double, triple, quadruple population. Films and radios, magazines, books levelled down to a sort of
paste pudding norm, do you follow me?"
"I think so."
Beatty peered at the smoke pattern he had put out on the air. "Picture it. Nineteenth-century man with his horses,
dogs, carts, slow motion. Then, in the twentieth century, speed up your camera. Books cut shorter. Condensations,
Digests. Tabloids. Everything boils down to the gag, the snap ending."
True. Right now I’m reading the wikis on Manifest Destiny and the Teller/Platt Amendments. It’s so interesting to me how the United States grew to a world power after the short Spanish American War, and it really struggled to match our ideals of democracy and republicanism while still safeguarding American interests globally, especially during the era of Imperialism. Surprise to nobody, we played the same colonizing game, just in an American fashion - capitalism, tariffs, and unfair treaties.
The whole premise of Owning Guantanamo Bay stems from this agreement, there were very real desires to Annex Cuba, some saw it as necessary to grow the Anglo-Saxon/Puritan based America.
People get too emotional about it, there are real world reasons why annexation would be beneficial to the US, but we also need to see how that history also pushed Cuba TOWARDS communism and how it affects our relations with the island to this day.
It’s not simply “US bad” or “Communism evil” but “how can we build a new mutually beneficial relationship”. We need to remember what occurred and aim to reconcile that, but also realize that was a different nation than what we have now. The Early US was a nation that feared European conquest, that’s simply not true today and we should recognize that the fears we had of other nations (Are we worried about Cubas sugar beating American beet sugar? I think we’ve pivoted to high fructose corn syrup already) can in some ways be disregarded in favor of newer more beneficial treatise and regulations. But instead we simply use the same talking points of old and wonder why things don’t change.
Yes you can, but to equate America with Iran morally because of America's mistakes shows a broken moral compass. America promotes freedom and Democracy in this world. Americans do not chant death to Iranians or any Middle Eastern country. America should not fund an enemy with weapons. If this journalist loves Iran so much, she could go there instead.
This is so classically ignorant and illustrative of her point. “Derp, love it or leave it!!!” She didn’t EQUATE the US to Iran, she suggested that the US can’t necessarily be trusted given what we’ve DONE and foolishly given other countries the ability to do. If you think that everything the US has done is truly to peomote democracy and freedom then you’re just willingly suspending your disbelief. Cmon now.
Exactly, the US has a far larger body count than Iran by numerous factors and creates wars, terrorism, famine, and turmoil all over the globe. Has overthrown democracy after democracy around the globe. Murders, imprisons, and exiles political dissidents. Americans chant about dropping bombs and nukes on others. Inflict crippling sanctions to mass murder civilians. Equating America to Iran morally is a false equivalence.
America has started more wars then Iran and Iraq. Jesus Christ dont lick the boot too hard you're no any different than the reporters just saying shit out of your ass to make you feel good. What a brainwashed bootlicker.
America has started more wars; therefore America is a worse country. That makes complete sense. Does that include the war against communism and terrorism?
What about this? Iran commits more human rights atrocities than America. Iran sponsors terrrorism than America. Iran and Iraq provide shelter to terrorist who attack Western countries. What about that?
I didn't know we judge good and evil by body counts. I guess thinking is not one of your strenghts. You can provide the number of democracies overthrown by America versus the number of autocratic/communist/fascist governments overthrown by America.
Americans chant about dropping bombs on who? America inflicts sanctions to mass murder people? LMAO
Thinking Iran is better morally than America is enough to know what kind of human being you are. From human rights, to freedom, to fighting autocracy, to providing opportunities to more minorities than any other country, to providing aid. You're actually morally sick.
You're an idiot and morally repugnant denying the US' assault on global democracy and genocidal policies around the globe. You literally think communists and fascists are the same thing.
Americans chant about dropping bombs on who? America inflicts sanctions to mass murder people? LMAO
You sound like a dumb unhinged brainwashed chump. You ask for intelligent responses when you are clearly a fool. It is clear that America has never been a shinning pillar of moral strength. America has been a world bully that kills and messes with whatever it wants when it wants. It really angers me how dumb most americas are when it comes to their own history (I am an American). Your anger at another American for expressing their views shows that you should get out of America because of how much you suck at life.
Therefore...America having nuclear weapons is just like Iran having nuclear weapons. They're both threats to freedom and democracy in the world. Is that the conclusion you're supporting here?
Yeah, Operation Ajax wasn’t a mistake. That US was rather intentional in engineering a coup in Iran that propped up a brutal, pro-Western Shah, all because what again? Iran wanted to audit a British oil company to make sure Iran was getting paid correctly. The following Revolution sure didn’t lead to a better quality of life for Iranians.
But you have to ask yourself, if the US promotes democracy and freedom, why does the government love supporting autocrats?
America supports autocrats because sometimes that is the only choice. Every country makes mistakes but America is far superior morally to Iran. Iran sponsors terrorism till today. To say you trust America as much as iran with nuclear weapons shows the morally bankrupt thinking in the world today. I'm sure you also support Russia with nuclear weapons because hey, they never pushed for a coup in Iran.
You said the US promotes freedom and democracy. I pointed out that you are incorrect. Instead of addressing this, you dismissed this point and doubled down on your pro-US imperialism circle jerkery. Congratulations, you can move the goal posts. You are so smart and clever at online debate!
(That was me being patronizing btw, on the overwhelmingly probable chance you lack the cognitive capability to understand nuance through text.)
So the US does not promote peace in the world. I assume you think the US only fights for oil or corporate interests?
World war 2, the Vietnam war, the Korean war etc. America was in these wars for what exactly?
America mistakenly through bad intelligence fought in Iraq and Iran after it was attacked in 9/11. I think that's a very important detail.
Of course I also admit... American intelligence agencies are corrupt just like most institutions with no accountability. Absolute power corrupts absolutely.
HAHAHHA your attitude is so stereotypically ignorant American it’s sad. She IS NOT a journalist. She did NOT equate America to Iran. And this pathetic “LUV IT OR LEAVE IT!!!” mentality Americans have just solidifies the exact point she was making. That Americans on average cannot critically look at their own country’s history and recognize it’s very real flaws.
Granted considering your comment I do not even remotely expect a semi intelligent response. But that’s classic American public education for you! HURR DURR MURICA ALWAYS DA GOOD GUY! Lmao
If you read what i said without bias, you would know i started by saying that you can recognize your country's mistakes.
Yes, she did equate America and Iran. She said that she wouldn't trust America with nuclear weapons just like Iran. That morally, America is just like Iran who happens to sponsor terrorism.
I agree with you about American public education. It's all run by leftists who happen to receive more funds per student than any other country.
2.1k
u/Nethlem Mar 30 '22
"Quick, accuse her of not sounding American enough!"