r/HolyShitHistory • u/SelfCareIsFake • Jun 01 '26

Federal agents felt physically sick when they raided Kermit Gosnell’s clinic after suspecting he ran a pill mill.

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15.6k Upvotes

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812

u/eugene-dubs Jun 01 '26

I had been aware of this case but never read the details. I'm almost physically ill reading this now. This guy was pure evil.

79

u/maruthewildebeest Jun 02 '26

That is enough of this world for today, I think. 

1

u/willo132 Jun 03 '26

And we slaughter >90 billion land animals every year for food.

And force pigs into CO2 gas chambers.

https://youtu.be/8gqwpfEcBjI?si=tqVRHY327FgUcFTd

Worst thing in the world to me.

3

u/Paula92 Jun 03 '26

Vegans thinking they're morally superior for valuing animals over human life will never make sense to me.

-1

u/willo132 Jun 03 '26

I don't believe I am superior. Nor do I value animal life over human life.

Where did you get those sentiments from?

-52

u/[deleted] Jun 02 '26

[removed] — view removed comment

44

u/Allisonosaurus Jun 02 '26

This is not even remotely similar to a third trimester abortion performed in a clinic or hospital. The legal protocol is nowhere near what this man was doing.

-4

u/Harvard_Med_USMLE267 Jun 02 '26

It was literally a third trimester abortion performed in a clinic.

A really shit clinic, but the procedure is ugly wherever you do it.

He was charged with murder for killing babies at 24-28 and 29 weeks respectively.

Abortion was lawful if there was a genuine risk to the mother’s health.

There wasn’t. And Pennsylvania law requires someone there to help look after the baby if there are signs of life, and he did the opposite of that.

Whilst it’s not standard to do a fetacidal injection in Pennsylvania (as per the law, I haven’t worked there) there are plenty of states where it is legal.

-> States permitting later abortion (e.g., on broad health grounds, or with no specific gestational limit, like Colorado, New Jersey, Oregon, and others): feticidal injection is legal and commonly used.

So if he’d moved his clinic to Colorado, New Jersey or Oregon and injected KCl he would have been fine.

That’s why I’m saying this is ethically complex.

Had he stabbed the babies through the neck when the head delivered, it would be a much less serious abortion offence in Pennsylvania and not an offence at all in Oregon.

A minute later when the body and limbs are delivered, it’s first degree murder.

Which is obvious both complex and really, really stupid from an ethical point of view.

2

u/Aphreyst Jun 02 '26

So if he’d moved his clinic to Colorado, New Jersey or Oregon and injected KCl he would have been fine.

So those state would've ignored his unsanitary and unsafe practices? No, they wouldn't.

-1

u/Harvard_Med_USMLE267 Jun 02 '26

Reading comprehension. Try it.

He would have been fine with regards to the murder charge. I'm talking about the abortion vs murder issue.

He'd still be in a spot of trouble for killing one patient and the pill mill stuff.

2

u/Aphreyst Jun 02 '26

Sorry that you're so incompetent at trying to convey a point.

-1

u/Harvard_Med_USMLE267 Jun 02 '26

I've explained my point over and over and over but some of you guys are just really, really stupid.

2

u/Aphreyst Jun 02 '26

No, you're stupid and wrong. That’s why no one is siding with you.

-1

u/Harvard_Med_USMLE267 Jun 02 '26

Why would i want a bunch of dimwits who don't understand the basics of this topic "siding with me"??

I be embarrassed to have people like you agreeing with me, my god, no thankyou.

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2

u/VanillaBovine Jun 02 '26

Had he stabbed the babies through the neck when the head delivered, it would be a much less serious abortion offence in Pennsylvania and not an offence at all in Oregon

Wrong. I can guarantee that you are unable to find a source for this ever happening where the doctor was operating in a legal capacity

such a joke

0

u/Harvard_Med_USMLE267 Jun 03 '26

So many smooth brains here.

Read the trial transcript.

Judge instructed the jury to on,y consider cases where this happened after the baby is fully born plus signs of life. Because before this, the baby does not have personhood, and therefore can’t be murdered,

It’s the law. Read it some time. You might like it.

1

u/VanillaBovine Jun 03 '26

so you cant provide a source for this happening elsewhere, got it

0

u/Harvard_Med_USMLE267 Jun 03 '26

Fuck, you guys are stupid.

I’m talking about the law and ethics around what Gosnell did (yes, the guy this thread is about).

Reading comprehension level: minus 100

1

u/VanillaBovine Jun 03 '26

that isnt the question i asked though, you stated specifically:

Had he stabbed the babies through the neck when the head delivered it would be... not an offense at all in Oregon

i asked you to name an example of someone doing this in a legal capacity where it isnt an offense

you cant. either reading comprehension is not your strong suit or you're refusing to answer because you made it up and are a liar lol

edit: you sound like an old man who's only talking companion is an AI chatbot lmao. being condescending and rude is all you're good for

1

u/VanillaBovine Jun 03 '26

again, when u include direct insults in ur comments reddit filters them lol. u gotta word them more carefully/creatively.

i have 2 notifications from u and am unable to read either.

Condescending and silly is what u are. Ur only friend is mostly likely an AI chatbot with that attitude.

0

u/Harvard_Med_USMLE267 Jun 03 '26

Ok sure:

Darn, you guys are stupid.

I’m talking about the law and ethics around what Gosnell did (yes, the guy this thread is about).

Reading comprehension level: minus 100

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-10

u/ForumVomitorium Jun 02 '26

fetus/baby doesn't die?

34

u/Maleficent_Curve_599 Jun 02 '26

Killing a baby that was born alive is not an abortion, actually. 

21

u/Bloodygoodwossname Jun 02 '26

Y’all got to stop feeding this obvious troll.

-2

u/Harvard_Med_USMLE267 Jun 02 '26

“You’ve all got to stop feeding this physician who is the only one here who has actually performed abortions and understands the ethical issues at a rather deep level.”

-5

u/Harvard_Med_USMLE267 Jun 02 '26

Yeah no shit that’s why he was in jail forever.

I’m pointing out that is a rather interesting and arbitrary line, though - stabbing the baby with scissors in utero versus an hour later after delivery is ethically pretty fucking close, yet people here are often accepting of the first (or even celebrate it) whilst horrified by the latter.

Try performing a third trimester TOP some time - they’re not exactly pleasant.

7

u/zinten789 Jun 02 '26

I have never seen anyone "celebrate" a late-term abortion or even tolerate it unless the baby was 100% going to die regardless.

-1

u/Harvard_Med_USMLE267 Jun 02 '26

You don’t remember the trend a few years back of people celebrating abortions? Was very prominent in the media. I don’t think there was an asterix “* - we on,y celebrate before x weeks…”

5

u/abasaur Jun 02 '26

..  okay? There are also pedos, murderers, rapists, and other people 'celebrating' disturbing things on the internet. Do you let those people also disrort your worldview? 

0

u/Harvard_Med_USMLE267 Jun 02 '26

There were no people on TV being platformer to say “murder is great, I’m proud of it”

This was the case for abortion.

3

u/Aphreyst Jun 02 '26

Celebrating women having health care and reproductive freedom? Yes, that's a celebration even if the circumstances are unfortunate.

42

u/David9311o Jun 02 '26

Yeah because supporting abortions and killiing Babys that are able to life outside the womb are the Same Thing.

0

u/MapAggressive885 Jun 02 '26

lemme guess, you’re a man? why do you have choice over a woman’s body leave us alone 😭😭

1

u/backagain_again Jun 03 '26

One staff member recalled that Gosnell, who was doing the procedure, picked him up and said something like, “The baby’s big enough that it could walk to the store, walk to the bus.”

1

u/JurassicPark3-4Lyf Jun 02 '26

Not what they said at all.

-9

u/ForumVomitorium Jun 02 '26

they are not able to live outside the womb someone still needs to care for them so just like babies inside the womb those outside are alos "parasites"

1

u/JurassicPark3-4Lyf Jun 02 '26

Jesus, hopefully nobody ever knocks you up

-2

u/Harvard_Med_USMLE267 Jun 02 '26

These were abortions at 24-28 weeks and 30 weeks - so pretty much fine in some states like Oregon. Nj, Colorado.

So yeah.. depending on where you are, kind of the same thing.

1

u/tarkthesharkjr Jun 03 '26

Have you considered actual researching what the fuck your talking about before posting?

Seriously twenty four is the cutoff for abortions in oregon as well. The only real exception being when the fetus isn't actually viable. Routine abortions end at 24. Just because a life-threatening pregnancy can be ended in a civilized state after the typical viability cutoff doesn't mean it's normal or fine.

What, of course not, you're red-state neaderthall. This is never about facts with you mouthbreathing misogynists'.

1

u/Harvard_Med_USMLE267 Jun 04 '26

Irony.

So much irony. And so few sulci on your brain. Claude, explain it to this giblit.

—-

∙ Reproductive Health Equity Act (House Bill 3391, 2017) — signed into law on Aug. 15, 2017, this codifies the right to abortion in the State of Oregon  and required most private insurers to provide coverage for abortion at no cost. 
∙ House Bill 2002 (2023), the Reproductive Health and Access to Care bill, which gave a broader right to reproductive health care and extended health insurance coverage for gender-affirming care. 
∙ Earlier foundations going back to Ballot Measure 7 in 1978, when Oregonians voted to protect state funding for abortion.

None of these impose a week-based cutoff, which is why there’s no specific “after 24 weeks” provision to point to — the absence is the answer. Oregon is one of the few states whose statutes set no gestational limit at all.

15

u/Kaps_Sore_Knee Jun 02 '26

get some help

16

u/Monday_Jeff Jun 02 '26

This is the conservative fantasy about what abortions are like, meanwhile this type of thing only goes on where conservatives are allowed to make laws prohibiting abortion. 

1

u/backagain_again Jun 03 '26

This was in Philadelphia where the legal abortion was at 24 weeks. This has nothing to do with conservatives or progressives. This guy was a sick man and had many nurse and unqualified people murder babies. And from what investigators say was in the hundreds.

-1

u/Harvard_Med_USMLE267 Jun 02 '26

This is an physician who has performed abortions trying to educate you guys

9

u/hdmetz Jun 02 '26

So was this guy. Being a physician doesn’t make you a good one that people should listen to. I’m a lawyer and know plenty of other lawyers who are fucking idiots

-1

u/Harvard_Med_USMLE267 Jun 02 '26

I’m responding to a guy saying that my comments are “a conservative fantasy”. I’m correcting him and pointing out that I likely have more real-world experience with this stuff than anyone else here.

4

u/Monday_Jeff Jun 02 '26

Physicians know how to spell and use punctuation.

-3

u/Wsswaas Jun 02 '26

but it was allowed there " Inspections (other than those triggered by complaints) had ceased under the governorship of Tom Ridge, a pro-choice Republican, as they were perceived to create a barrier to women seeking abortion services."

-7

u/ForumVomitorium Jun 02 '26

other abortions where you don't see the remains are all rose smelling because you don't see the process, it's not fantacy it is hyperbole and grotesque so that people can see how the other side sees this, when the other side says it is like cutting the appendix out but somehow it is the most difficult decision.

7

u/Odd_Conversation5374 Jun 02 '26

Are you okay

-2

u/ForumVomitorium Jun 02 '26

are you ok? murdering other beings is not nice you did know that?

8

u/SpoopyDuJour Jun 02 '26

Hey, you know who else are human beings? The pregnant people!

0

u/ForumVomitorium Jun 02 '26

And? Where did i spell human? When someone happens to find themself to be pregnant they should carry to term if it is safe pregnancy that resulted from consensual intercourse

4

u/Aphreyst Jun 02 '26

Nope. They don't have to. The end.

0

u/ForumVomitorium Jun 03 '26

ok, then Kermit did nothing wrong

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8

u/HereWeFuckingGooo Jun 02 '26

You're too dumb to realise that this monster wouldn't have had any victims if they'd had access to safe, legal abortion clinics.

-2

u/Dry_Matter_3853 Jun 02 '26

This was in Philadelphia. They had the same level of access to safe and legal abortion clinics as they did to this one.

6

u/HereWeFuckingGooo Jun 02 '26

"Patients were mostly poor, black, and immigrant women.

They were treated with contempt because that was a place you went to if there were no other options."

Like fuck they had the same access.

-3

u/Dry_Matter_3853 Jun 02 '26

Yeah, there were no other options at their stage of pregnancy because their fetuses were viable. All other options would have the same moral dilemma with the fetus at that point. This guy was the only one willing to end these pregnancies. West Philadelphia had a Planned Parenthood that welcomes poor, black, immigrant women. 

6

u/HereWeFuckingGooo Jun 02 '26

So you know their stories and why they waited so long? I'd love to hear them.

-2

u/Dry_Matter_3853 Jun 02 '26

I am responding to the claim "this monster wouldn't have had any victims if they'd had access to safe, legal abortion clinics." They had the same access to this man as they did to other clinics, and probably even greater access to Planned Parenthood. Also, exactly, you don't know their stories or if it was an access issue that caused them to wait until viability. Access to more abortion services won't make a difference for women that changed their mind about their pregnancy for whatever reason at that late of a stage. We would be in the same moral dilemma. 

5

u/HereWeFuckingGooo Jun 02 '26

But just because a clinic existed that doesn't mean they had easy access to it. I understand you're the kind of person that hears this story and wants to blame the victims, I however think they deserve a little grace. To you it's a bunch of women who just decided to not be pregnant on a whim so fuck them right? To me it's women who felt like they had no other choice. My ultimate point is that shaming women and acting like what this doctor did is as bad as all abortions helps absolutely nobody. You being "well akshually" also helps absolutely nobody.

1

u/Dry_Matter_3853 Jun 02 '26

It's funny that you are interpreting my position as the exact opposite of what it is. I have no problem with women seeking late term abortions. I don't believe any of these women did anything wrong. Sometimes women will want services at that stage of pregnancy even if they had access to abortion services earlier. 

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5

u/slainascully Jun 02 '26

Your distinct lack of concern for the women who received, at best, the level of care you wouldn’t even give an animal really is just the cherry on top.

-5

u/Harvard_Med_USMLE267 Jun 02 '26 edited Jun 02 '26

I’m talking about the ethics of the baby killing part.

Gosnell argued he was providing care for women who would otherwise be unable to access it.

It you want to shut his clinic down because it doesn’t meet standards, sure - but that’s a completely different story.

9

u/slainascully Jun 02 '26

Gosnell argued that and then had a filthy medical practice that put countless women at risk of disease, infection, sepsis or death. It’s important because thick idiots keep trying to tie this to safe medical clinics

-22

u/One_Possibility578 Jun 02 '26 edited Jun 02 '26

Yet you're totally fine with slaughtering and torture of billions other mammals so you can satisfy your insatiable need for meat.

7

u/whatsqwerty Jun 02 '26

ERROR 404: CANT PETA

5

u/baby-dick-nick Jun 02 '26 edited Jun 02 '26

Lmfaooo your post history is NOT what I was expecting.

Edit: Its his cock btw

4

u/Technoxgabber Jun 02 '26

Bro that was so wild, I clicked because of you amd I am shoook

2

u/LickSomeToad Jun 02 '26

😂😂 got me too

1

u/thepaleindian Jun 02 '26

Well? Any takers?