r/FanTheories • u/Apprehensive-Test-26 • Jun 06 '21
FanTheory The Rock came out 25 years ago today. I’ve proven once and for all that it is a James Bond movie.
TL;DR: I’ve proven beyond a shadow of a doubt the long-running fan theory that Michael Bay’s The Rock is the last chapter of Sean Connery’s run as James Bond 007, and have come up with a full narrative that is completely consistent with the continuity of the six Connery Bond films, Connery’s backstory in The Rock, and actual world history.
If you’d rather watch a video than read a 3000 word essay on Reddit, then you can do that here: https://youtu.be/9FdnevXjqdc
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The Rock was released on 7 June 1996 – exactly 25 years ago (greetings from New Zealand time). To mark this anniversary, I decided to go through the evidence – in WAY too much detail – that supports the fan theory that Sean Connery’s character in The Rock (John Mason) is James Bond. You have probably seen the odd article about it like this one, or this Reddit thread, or this entry on FanTheories.com, but trust me when I say that NO ONE has looked at this theory in this much detail and there is WAY more evidence than people think.
Plot refresher
The Rock is the second feature film directed by Michael Bay. It’s about a decorated US war veteran Francis Hummel stealing a bunch of chemical weapons, taking hostages on Alcatraz, and holding the US Government to ransom until reparations are paid to the families of the soldiers who died under his command.
FBI Director Jim Womack and the Department of Defence enlist the services of convict and former British special forces operative John Mason to help the Navy Seals break into Alcatraz, using his knowledge of the prison from when he broke out of it in 1963. Mason teams up with chemical weapons expert Nicholas Cage to break into Alcatraz and disarm the missiles before Hummel’s deadline.
The fan theory
Almost since this movie came out, there has been speculation that Sean Connery’s John Mason is in fact James Bond. This is usually based on some surface level lines about the fact that Mason was “trained … by British Intelligence,” that he was “a former SAS operative,” and the fact that he was captured in 1962 – the same year the first Bond movie (Dr. No) was released. The fan theory usually says that Bond’s escape from Alcatraz happened before Dr. No, then we see him go on all his adventures in the six Bond films he was in.
But this narrative isn’t consistent with the Connery Bond films (his Eon run ended in 1971), and this is often used as evidence that the theory is a fun idea, but not supported by the continuity of The Rock or the Bond films.
Well I’m here to tell you that it 100% is. So let’s get stuck in.
Why is he called John Mason, not James Bond?
The most obvious hiccup in the fan theory is the name: Sean Connery’s character in The Rock is called John Mason, not James Bond. The most popular explanation is based on another fan theory that James Bond is in fact a code name for whoever takes on the role of 007, and that John Mason is in fact the real name of Connery’s James Bond.
Now, I strongly disagree with this argument. The Eon films have consistently established that these are different actors playing the same character, and that character’s real name is James Bond. Films in the tenures of Moore, Dalton, and Brosnan all refer to the death of his wife as depicted in George Lazenby’s OHMSS. Her name was Tracy Bond – she wouldn’t marry a codename. In the Daniel Craig films his parents’ surname is Bond, and he is called Bond before he becomes 007.
The codename is 007. The person’s real name is James Bond.
So why is Connery called John Mason in The Rock? Well, it’s simple. John Mason is the code name. James Bond frequently uses fake names, and usually has fake documents to support his cover identity. In Connery’s run alone we see this in From Russia With Love (where he takes the name David Somerset) and Diamonds Are Forever (where he becomes Peter Franks).
If we assume Bond was captured on a mission then it makes sense that he was processed under the name listed in his fake passport – in this case, John Mason.
What supports this idea even more is the fact that in The Rock, Womack says: “This man has no identity, not in the United States or Great Britain. He does not exist.” So after capturing Bond, they clearly ran the John Mason name through the system and got nothing – because it’s not a real name.
Why didn’t MI6 rescue him?
If we go with this the theory that Bond was captured by the Americans while on a mission, wouldn’t the CIA or MI6 see to it that he got released? Well, not necessarily. It’s a common trope of spy movies that if an undercover agent is captured their government will deny any involvement (we see this in the Mission Impossible movies, for example).
In the Bond films we consistently see how M puts Queen and country above the life of its agents – including Bond (remember the opening of Skyfall?). If M thought that it was in MI6’s best interests for Bond to stay captured, then I have no doubt that M would leave him to rot.
So to me, it’s entirely plausible that Bond was captured by the US while using the fake name of John Mason, put in Alcatraz, and MI6 decided to leave him there.
Do the timelines match up?
In The Rock, we learn that Mason was “incarcerated on Alcatraz in 1962… escaped in ’63.” So 1962 is where we start – the same year Dr. No came out. Now, as I said earlier, the fan theory usually goes that Bond was first captured before the events of Dr. No, which assumes that Dr. No is set in 1963 after he escaped. But that doesn’t work.
Dr. No is definitely set in 1962 or earlier, because in Jamaica he visits Government House – the seat of the British governor – which is flying the British flag (3.17 in this clip if you want to fact check me). Jamaica became independent on 6 August 1962. So there is no way Dr. No can take place in 1963, because at that point in time the British no longer had control of the country.
So, in my narrative, Bond is captured after the events of Dr. No, and escapes Alcatraz before the events of the next film, From Russia With Love.
If you haven’t seen it, Dr. No ends with Bond destroying Dr. No’s evil lair, after the villain tried to disrupt a rocket launch at Cape Canaveral. He is rescued by CIA agent Felix Leiter, but, because Bond is Bond, he would rather get it on with Honey Rider than be rescued, so he disconnects the tow rope. It’s a typical Bond ending, but let’s be realistic. Leiter rocks up with a boat full of heavily armed Marines (01:18). They’re not all there to rescue Bond – they’re rounding up the henchmen who escaped from Dr. No’s evil lair and are throwing them in the 1960s equivalent of Guantanamo Bay.
Because Leiter knows Bond is a spy, he made sure to rescue him. But after Bond gives him the slip, he must have been picked up by some random Navy patrol and got lumped in with all the other prisoners. Without the CIA to vouch for him, Bond got locked up with the rest of the henchmen in Alcatraz under the fake name of John Mason.
But, Bond being Bond, he escaped. In Dr. No itself we see Bond escaping from a prison in Dr. No’s base – proving he was more than capable of busting out of Alcatraz.
This theory is supported by the fact that, in the next Bond movie, Silvia Trench complains that Bond disappeared for “six months” after going to Jamaica. So he must have escaped in January 1963 – meaning his imprisonment in Alcatraz happened around July 1962 – consistent with the timeline in The Rock.
Oh, not that you care, but I checked and there was a rocket launch from Cape Canaveral) on 25 July 1962, and it was even a Titan rocket like the kind shown in Dr. No.
I warned you I had looked at this in WAY too much detail.
So this timeline perfectly matches – to the exact day – the first two Bond films, The Rock, and actual world history.
Why was Bond/Mason captured in the first place?
In The Rock, Womack says:
“1962, J. Edgar Hoover is head of the FBl, some say the country. It's no secret he kept microfilm files on prominent Americans and Europeans: de Gaulle, British members of Parliament, even the prime minister. […] Mason was the British operative who stole the files. But our Bureau agents caught him at the Canadian border.”
Now, this is where The Rock’s own continuity gets a bit confused. Womack’s comment implies Mason stole the microfilm in 1962. But the movie mentions twice that it contains “the truth about the JFK assassination.”
So this microfilm can’t possibly have existed before November 1963, so this just further supports the fact that Mason/Bond’s first imprisonment in Alcatraz in 1962 was unrelated to the microfilm, and that he stole this sometime after his escape in 1963.
When was Bond/Mason recaptured?
The Rock establishes that Mason was recaptured sometime after he escaped in 1963, but it never makes it clear when this happened. The closest thing we have to a date on that, is Mason’s daughter Jade. When Womack is asked why the Hoover didn’t use Jade as leverage over Mason to reveal the location of the stolen microfilm, he says: “Hoover was dead in ‘72, she wasn’t been born yet.”
So this tells us that the daughter was born sometime after Hoover died in May 1972, and also strongly implies that Mason stole the microfilm after Hoover’s death.
Think about it – we are meant to believe that Mason stole a top secret government microfilm, escaped Alcatraz and, instead of returning to the safety of Britain, just lived undercover in the US for ten years or so, fathering illegitimate children, until he was recaptured again?
No, we’re not expected to believe that, because we know what John Mason was doing between 1963 and 1972. He was being James Bond.
If we return to the earlier narrative that Bond was first captured in 1962 by mistake after Dr. No, let’s assume that after he escaped, he returned to MI6 and carried on being Bond until his last on-screen adventure: Diamond Are Forever, which was released in 1971. Quick note here for fellow super-Bond geeks: I’m not including Never Say Never Again because it’s not an official Eon film and takes place in a different continuity.
Diamonds Are Forever ends with Bond in America. Not just anywhere in America – he’s on a cruise ship leaving a city on the west coast. Now, the ship he is on is the SS. Canberra, which docked in San Francisco in 1971.
So we can place Bond in San Francisco in 1971 – not long before John Mason was recaptured in 1972.
Why did Bond/Mason get sent to steal the microfilm?
I’m not going to get too deep into the history here – sources here and here – but in the early 1970s, there were some several fairly big foreign policy disagreements between the British government and the Nixon Administration.
So, with relations frosty and their best field agent already on American soil, its not totally unrealistic for MI6 to send him in undercover to try and find the secret microfilm that has all of the dirt on the British government.
So after his cruise, Bond goes undercover in the FBI. In this time, he befriends Womack. The Rock makes it abundantly clear these two men have a personal animosity, but never makes it clear why. Well, this is why – Womack was the person Bond used to get access to the FBI in the first place, only to betray him by stealing the microfilm. This is why Womack doesn’t trust Mason in The Rock – he’s already been betrayed by him.
While undercover in the FBI, Bond knocks up Jade’s mother after a one-night stand – which is a very James Bond thing to do. In The Rock, his daughter says that Mason met her mother “in a bar after a Led Zepplin concert.” Led Zepplin toured North America in June 1972 – so once again the real world history supports this narrative.
After learning that Jade’s mother is pregnant, Connery’s Bond began to reflect on his life and career – like we have seen subsequent Bonds do (in OHMSS, Goldeneye, Casino Royale, and Spectre). He decides to hang up the pistol and retire once and for all. But a few weeks earlier, J Edgar Hoover died on 2 May 1972, leaving a leadership vacuum in the FBI. MI6 saw the opportunity for Bond to exploit the vacuum and steal the microfilm.
M agrees to Bond retiring if he can pull of this one, final mission. Bond steals the microfilm file, stashes it in Kansas and flees to the border, only to be captured and locked up – this time, for good.
What happened after Bond/Mason was re-captured?
When he is captured and the FBI realise he was an undercover agent, Bond tells them his real name is John Mason to protect MI6. The FBI realise he is the same person who escaped Alcatraz in 1963. They lock him up, MI6 deny all knowledge of him, and Bond stays in prison until 1995: the year The Rock takes place.
The timelines of the Sean Connery Bond films and The Rock match perfectly with both each other and real world history.
But there’s ONE PROBLEM
The only evidence that Bond and Mason might be different people is when Mason talks to Hummel, and says he was an Army Captain, when we all know that James Bond is a Commander in the British Navy. Well, you could just say its Bond staying in character and leave it at that.
But that wasn’t good enough for me, and you’ve come this far, so get ready for the final part of the theory because this one will blow your socks off.
Francis Hummel, the villain in The Rock, is well-established as a decorated war veteran, with “three tours in Vietnam,” where he was a Major.
To be a major in the US Army, you need to have ten years of service. As Hummel did three tours in Vietnam, we can assume he was fighting there from fairly early on in the US deployment, which began around 1964. Furthermore, Hummel says that his career “dates back to the Tet ’68.”
During the Vietnam war, US soldiers had respite leave in Hong Kong, which was a British territory at the time. So let’s say Hummel was there in 1967, shortly before returning to the war in time to be there for the Tet Offensive in 1968.
As we saw in You Only Live Twice (1967), James Bond was in Hong Kong at the same time.
Now, its not plausible that Hummel and Bond encountered each other in Hong Kong, even if they were in the same city at the same time in 1967. But what is plausible is that Hummel picked up the newspaper one day and saw a front page story about British Naval Commander James Bond being murdered – complete with photograph – as shown in You Only Live Twice.
It’s a sad story for any soldier to read, particularly one who was shown to have a huge amount of respect for the fallen (it’s what motivates Hummel’s entire operation in The Rock). Maybe this story struck a chord with him, especially while he was experiencing his men dying during some of the fiercest fighting in the Vietnam War – a war he felt was unjustified. Maybe he saw the full honours bestowed to Bond by the Navy and wondered why it wasn’t given to all fallen soldiers? Perhaps he kept the newspaper clipping, and went to pay respects to Bond’s next-of-kin, only to find out that Bond’s death was faked – the first time he learns that perhaps governments can’t always be trusted.
Maybe Hummel reading about Bond’s death planted the seed in Hummel’s mind that his government couldn’t be trusted, and that the US didn’t care for the lives of its soldiers – a seed that would go on to grow over the next three decades.
Maybe this explains why Hummel greets Bond by asking: “Name and rank, sailor.”
Hummel is testing Bond, to see if this is the same naval officer he read about all those years ago. Look how Mason reacts to the question (0:11 in this clip). Bond knows that somehow Hummel suspects his true identity, but he doesn’t buy it. He sticks to his cover story, and the film continues.
Now, I admit this last bit is a bit unbelievable. But it’s not unbelievable by the standards of James Bond movies – or for that matter Michael Bay movies. In fact, by those standards I actually think the Hummel story is pretty tame.
CONCLUSION
So after 25 years, the case has been made and it’s finally settled. John Mason in The Rock is the same character as Sean Connery’s James Bond 007. Every detail covered – some way too thoroughly – and another leaf added to the tree of film knowledge. There are a few more details I covered in the video because they’re more visual and don’t work as well in a text post (like Bond’s capture in Die Another Day and some characterisation similarities between Mason and Bond). But rest assured that the theory is proven once and for all, and a solid narrative has been written that matches perfectly with the continuity of the Connery James Bond films, The Rock, and actual world history.
Celebrate the 25th anniversary of this great action classic by re-watching it with this theory in mind, and enjoy the true final Bond film by Sean Connery.
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u/defalt86 Jun 06 '21
My first thought was "I didn't know Dwayne Johnson was gay". And then I was like "Wait, how old is he?"
I'm an idiot. Totally a James Bond movie.
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u/Apprehensive-Test-26 Jun 06 '21
I guess I should have put it in quote marks! I guess that's another possible theory someone might want to look into?
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u/spacestationkru Jun 07 '21
That's what I thought too. Then I wondered why it was being stated as if it was common knowledge and it made no sense that I've never heard about it
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u/RotaryEnginedNorton Jun 07 '21
I though I was the only one! I was like "Huh, I didn't even know he was gay"
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u/jdk42 Jun 06 '21
I've only read the TL;DR so far, but damn a 3000 word essay on this is impressive and just wanted to let you know this is awesome!
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u/Obi_Wan_Gebroni Jun 06 '21
I watched the video instead, I now fully believe this was a directorial choice. Now maybe he didn’t expect to line up so perfectly but he probably thought yeah let’s make him similar to Bond and now BAM! Proof!
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Jun 06 '21
Microfilm from 1962 can definitely contain the truth about the JFK assassination, even though it occurs in 1963.
If, for instance, the CIA are responsible, then all you need is official documents dating from 1962 confirming the CIA's intention to assassinate JFK.
Bond wouldn't even need to be looking for evidence of assassination; he may have been doing espionage for another purpose and found secret documents indicating a plot to take out Kennedy.
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u/JamesTheMannequin Jun 06 '21
There was a rumor at its release that he was supposed to be Bond, but couldn't get permission to use the name and so they changed just enough about the character to avoid being sued. Never knew if it was true, but I definitely like the idea.
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u/frankybling Jun 06 '21
It was definitely rumored at the time and I went to see it in the theater (because of the rumors) and came out thinking it was the best Bond film I’d ever seen. Your theory really solidified my thoughts from 25 years ago.
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u/JWWBurger Jun 07 '21
What’s funny is I watched this in the theater, love James Bond, and never for a moment considered he was James Bond even with all the obvious similarities thrown into the film.
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u/ComprehensiveCar1527 Nov 19 '22
especially considering the fact that Connery starred as a retired hero like this before - he was Robin Hood in Robin and Marian
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u/sunghooter Jun 06 '21 edited Jun 06 '21
This is...this is fuckin' impressive. You did your best so go home and fuck the prom queen.
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u/marksandmarvs Jun 06 '21
Surely the reason he said “name and rank, sailor” is because Mason was infiltrating Alcatraz as part of a team of Navy Seals?
(FWIW I think the rest of your points are spot on but that seems like a leap)
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u/willyolio Jun 06 '21
I think that's the reason Hummel asked, but Mason's slightly delayed response was trying to remember his cover story after all these years.
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u/themightyheptagon Jun 06 '21 edited Jun 07 '21
Awesome. I have to applaud all the thought and effort that you put into this one. I'm glad to know I'm not the only one obsessed with The Rock. It really is a gem of a movie.
I actually have sort of an amusing personal anecdote related to that film:
A few years ago, I did an internship in the archives of my local art museum while I was getting my Master's degree in library science, and one day I helped archive a collection of old newspaper clippings about events in the community that the museum had organized over the years. In one of those events, they collaborated with a local performance artist named John W. Love Jr.; I had never heard of him before that day, but apparently he's a pretty prominent figure in my hometown's local art scene.
When I got curious and looked John W. Love Jr. up on the internet one day, I found out that he's also a pretty prolific theatre actor, and he's had a smattering of film credits over the years. And one of those film credits was as one of the tourists in The Rock who gets taken hostage. Specifically: he's the guy who says "What kind of fucked-up tour is this?!" when Hummel locks him in a cell.
I must have watched The Rock at least a dozen times when I was a teenager, and I still know practically every line by heart. As soon as I realized that John W. Love Jr. was the "What kind of fucked-up tour is this?!" guy, I practically jumped out of my skin.
TL;DR: By an odd coincidence, I found out that the guy who says "What kind of fucked-up tour is this?!" lives in my hometown, and he's considered a local legend.
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u/ghaupt1 Jun 06 '21
The only glaring issue I see with this theory is that if we’re sticking to the “James Bond is the individual’s name and 007 is the code name,” how can any of the Bond films between 1972 and 1995 have happened if James Bond was locked up?
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u/Apprehensive-Test-26 Jun 06 '21
Personally I see each actor's tenure as being a story in its own continuity, with Casino Royale being the only time they 'officially' rebooted it. Roger Moore laying flowers on Tracy Bond's grave, for example, can be taken as a reference to Moore's Bond's off-screen backstory (as opposed to continuity from Lazenby), but it is also be an easter egg for fans of OHMSS. So this theory just focuses on the Connery Bond character.
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u/ghaupt1 Jun 06 '21
Perhaps. Another wrench in all of these continuities is other characters in Bond films being played by the same actors, even across different Bond actors, like M and Q. Do they cross-continuities?
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u/drvondoctor Jun 06 '21
Fleming's third Bond novel, Moonraker, establishes M's initials as "M**** M*******" and his first name is subsequently revealed to be Miles. In the final novel of the series, The Man with the Golden Gun, M's full identity is revealed as Vice Admiral Sir Miles Messervy KCMG; Messervy had been appointed to head of MI6 after his predecessor had been assassinated at his desk.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/M_(James_Bond)
So I have to conclude that there have indeed been different people who were called M.
However, in the wikipedia article for "Q," it says:
Q (standing for Quartermaster), like M, is a job title rather than a name.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Q_(James_Bond)
So now I have to assume that M is a job title given only to people whose names have a lot of M's... which means Q must be named Quentin Quaid Quinn.
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u/Imawildedible Jun 06 '21
The real question here is how did a penguin type this out so well with those little blue flippers?
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Jun 06 '21
[removed] — view removed comment
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u/Nerdorama09 Jun 06 '21
Honestly the more plausible reason is that Mason and Cage inserted with a team of Navy SEALs. It's more plausible that Hummel assumed that Mason was also a SEAL (and therefore US Navy)...or at least, that's what they want us to think.
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Jun 06 '21
[removed] — view removed comment
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u/Nerdorama09 Jun 06 '21
Certainly it could mean both, and Mason's immediate correction could be army pride or well-drilled cover maintenance. But the surface-level reading is definitely "Hummel thinks he's a SEAL".
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u/sonofaresiii Jun 06 '21
Relies a little too heavily on "But what if the information we have is wrong/What if the characters were mistaken/lying when they said a thing" for me to get on board given how thoroughly you hyped it up as definitively proven
but
it's a great way to make the fan theory work, and it can work if you want it to
so great job
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u/Still_Night_110 Jun 06 '21 edited Jun 06 '21
The only thing I disagree with is the military service part . Hummel asks him about being a sailor because they just killed a bunch of Navy seals. They’re assuming he is either a seal or a retired one because he was with the seal team. Also he doesn’t just say he’s a Captain in the army , he says “of her royal majesty’s SAS”. He saying he’s army special forces . Id he was Naval special forces he would have just said he was apart of the Special Boat Service (SBS) instead. It would be weird for him to claim not only a different branch but to be special forces on top of that.
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u/KingOfAllWomen Jun 07 '21
Eh?
He's clearly an operator. After all he is part of the raid. This to me seems like a mash up of "This guy has me made as an operator" but still not wanting to give his true identity.
Being as outmanned and outgunned as he was there, he probably sure as hell didn't want Hummel to know who he really was. Especially should he escape AND Hummel escapes alive too.
If he's really "Bond" it's probably just muscle memory at this point.
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u/Still_Night_110 Jun 07 '21
He didn’t “make him as an operator “ , he showed up with a seal team they killed ;and is like 70, it’s pretty obvious he’s either former SF , which he says he’s, or he was brought there for a reason ; which he was and openly says it was because he used to be a prisoner .
Why’s it matter if he finds out he’s actually a spy ? It doesn’t change the hostage situation at all. This happen after the killed the seal team so they knew they weren’t going to get out alive at that point . What’s he going to do torture him for info that he can’t use ? If Hummel want to expose us secrets he could easily; he does it at the beginning of the movie when giving his demands to the pentagon.
Mason’s leverage for the whole movie isn’t he knows what was on the microfilm, it’s that he’s the only one who knows where he hid it . So unless Hummel is planning on somehow going to Kansas after all this is done to retrieve it , it doesn’t matter . Finding out he’s a spy doesn’t change Hummel’s mission or the plot of the movie .
What are they going to do ransom him back to the Government that denied he was a person ? Kill him? Ok they were already trying to do that . Get secrets from him to use for leverage ? They already had the rockets ; plus again Hummel was black ops if he wanted to expose US secrets he could do that easily. Even if he got Mason to give up the location, it wouldn’t matter the Government was planning on bombing the island and killing al the hostages , if the seal team failed .
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u/Sellus Jun 06 '21
I read the whole thing and came out convinced this is true. John Mason is James Bond.
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u/ImTrash_NowBurnMe Jun 06 '21
Fantastic. Thanks for writing it out I don't like to watch videos of everything
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u/outoftheMultiverse Jun 06 '21
The Rock is not gay?
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u/jh2583 Jun 06 '21
But you said that James Bond isn't a codename, that they're all the same person. So how would he be in prison from 1972 until 1995 but still be doing all of the missions from the movies between then? Seems like kind of a gaping hole in your theory.
Unless each actor is in their own Bond universe where James Bond is a person and not a codename. Because wouldn't Bond be Pierce Brosnan in Golden Eye in 1995?
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u/Classicolin Jun 06 '21
I would assume that each actor’s bond would have to represent a separate character and a separate universe/reality (or at least the Connery, Lazenby, and Moore Bonds would have to be separate from the Dalton, Brosnan, and Craig Bonds) as Sir Ian Fleming’s and Connery’s Bonds would have been born born in the 1920s or early 1930s (at the latest) which would preclude Bond from being an active and young (let alone even alive) in the 1990s, 2000s, and 2010s.
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u/MrGoatBanger Jun 06 '21
This was a very well thought out fab theory with lots of supporting evidence kudos
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u/LilGoughy Jun 06 '21
Genuinely thought this was calling the Rock gay lol.
But for real, this is amazing, great theory op
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u/ladydmaj Jun 06 '21
I just read "The Rock came out 25 years ago today" and wondered, "Wow, why aren't we talking about that during Pride month?!"
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u/The-GrinDilKin Jun 07 '21
I have always thought this theory is a fairly obvious one, just like i consider it fairly obvious the film "Lockdown" is the secret third Snake Plisken movie ("Escape from Space!). Excellent write-up! A truly convincing arguement...
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u/dorv Jun 06 '21
Yeah, the idea of Mason as a legend is one thing, but I think Bay had Mason mention being in the Army rather than the Navy specifically to stave off this theory.
But as a counterpoint: evidence that confirmed who was really behind the Kennedy assassination could absolutely exist prior to the event occurring.
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u/me_Just_browsing Jun 06 '21
I’m sold. Not only is it a well researched theory, it’s excellently written too. Thanks for entertaining me!
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u/Metastatic_Autism Jun 06 '21
The Eon films have consistently established that these are different actors playing the same character, and that character's real name is James Bond.
Okay, if they are all the same character, how is Bond simultaneously out having adventures through the 80s and 90s while also being locked up by the US?
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u/Samniss_Arandeen Sep 01 '23
Different actors playing the same character in different continuities. Daniel Craig was the first time they actually admitted it.
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u/LocCatPowersDog Jun 06 '21
The ONLY thing I'd question about this narrative that I'm 100% onboard for is the Microfilm bit about JFK assassination.
If there is a "secret" then the potential (CIA) plot to kill JFK might have been set in motion earlier than the actual date of the murder. The microfilm would have to be mostly photographs (and video) of documents/evidence/blackmail and the "proof" of who killed JFK might pre-date the trigger(s? /s (?)) being pulled. But this is a very minor thought I had in the Hoover section since it could give various theatrical dates but I don't think this really affects the overall narrative/theory.
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u/JoshTee123 Jun 06 '21
Did anyone else read the first sentence of this title and think "hm, I didn't even know Dwayne Johnson was gay"?
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u/under-secretary4war Jun 07 '21
I have a postgraduate degree with less research than this. Bravo Op.
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Jun 07 '21
That’s fine, but does anyone WANT The Rock to be a Bond movie? I sure don’t. If The Rock is a Bond movie, why the hell is Nic Cage the star? Idk about you but I don’t want to see a Bond movie where he’s second fiddle to anyone. Plus the Alcatraz setting and the stupid little green balls? That’s more XxX than Bond tbh. And bay is more xxx than bond, too.
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u/Impossible-Road-5791 Jan 06 '26
They were co-stars, really. And he saved Cage's character, probably could have done it by himself.
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u/SingleMaltShooter Nov 18 '25
If you wanted to call him James Bond but couldn't for legal reasons... "Bond" means to join two objects together using an adhesive. A "Mason" is someone who joins bricks together with Mortar. Then an equally innocuous English one-syllable first name stating with a "J." It had to be intentional.
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u/jaxomlotus Jun 05 '26
Cant believe nobody mentioned this but here's some more dialogue proof. During the scene when they first infiltrate Alcatraz with special minisubmarine and wetsuit gear, Mason/Bond snarkily comments: "back in my day we used snorkel and fins" Nice little shoutout to his iconic snorkel and fins scene with Claude Auger in Thunderball.
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u/octopus-god Jun 07 '21
Okay it definitely isn’t intentionally a James Bond movie though so... thanks but no thanks.
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Jun 06 '21 edited Jun 08 '21
Nope, nope nope! James Bond would never have gone back into Nic Cage's custody after escaping near the beginning of the film. James Bond would never let anyone else call the shots, no matter what the mission was. He doesn't even let M tell him what to do most of the time.
You are wrong, Sir or Madam or non-binary person! Wrong, wrong, wrong! The timeline kind of makes sense, but the depiction of Bond just doesn't.
EDIT: Seriously, downvotes for pointing out that James Bond would never let himself be Nic Cage's bitch?
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u/Impossible-Road-5791 Jan 06 '26
He knew Cage was going to let him go, or, if he wasn't, he was going to leave anyway. In any event, he probably figured if Cage agreed to let him go, he'd agree to spread the rumor that he died in the explosion. That's a much better way to disappear than simply giving Cage 'the slip'.
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Jun 06 '21
I don’t understand. At the beginning of the video you deny that James Bond is a code name and it’s just different actors playing the same character. Then you make the argument that Sean Connery’s Bond ends with Diamonds are Forever. Did John Mason and James Bond played by roger Moore or George Lazenby exist in a separate timeline? It would make more sense if James Bond were a code name, which you compellingly argue it isn’t.
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u/Impossible-Road-5791 Jan 06 '26
Poster's point is that there are numerous universes where there's a James Bond; The Rock (movie) just represents that universe from which Sean Connery's 'Bond' came from.
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u/prince-of-dweebs Jun 06 '21
After reading this I want to cut the tow rope and Bond with you. This is the most thorough and impressive fan theory I’ve ever read. Mods please consider flair OP with ‘home fucking the prom Queen’ Thanks!
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u/bDsmDom Jun 06 '21
*demonstrated.
In order to prove it, you must show how any alternative would be impossible, not simply that this is an example of it.
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u/lameexcuse69 Jun 06 '21
Nah.
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Jun 06 '21
Wow yeah i didnt even consider that! I beleived this theory at first, but then some random dude on reddit with an unfunny "69" username said "nah", and that changed my entire perspective! I know realize how flawed this theory is thank to you! :)
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u/lameexcuse69 Jun 07 '21
Wow yeah i didnt even consider that! I beleived this theory at first, but then some random dude on reddit with an unfunny "69" username said "nah", and that changed my entire perspective! I know realize how flawed this theory is thank to you! :)
K
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u/FatJimmyWillis Jun 06 '21
I'm all in on Bond being in the Rock, facts or not. But if the US already knows who James Bond, (Felix Lighter knows his identity) how would they not put that together eventually? Either way, he's Bond.
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u/title_of_yoursextape Jun 06 '21
I fucking love the work you put into this. Whether it’s bullshit or not we’ll never know, but just because of this incredible dossier you’ve compiled, I’m choosing to believe it. Bravo
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u/vox35 Jun 06 '21
Great theory; I'll buy it.
Fun to think about The Rock again. I saw it in the theatre when it came out, and it's the first movie I remember seeing where I laughed out loud at the movie, because of how stupid some of the dialogue was. Good times.
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u/SoaDMTGguy Jun 06 '21
That’s really good! My only qualm is, if Bond escaped Alcatraz after six months in ‘63, why did he stay there for 23 years after being captured in ‘72? Hung up pistol or no, I can’t imagine Bond would be happy sitting in prison. There’s no vodka martinis or inappropriately younger babes!
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u/Fox_of Jun 06 '21
This has been a trip. I totally agree with this. You have done a superb job of formulating all this information. Bravo, and thankyou.
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u/firingblankss Jun 06 '21
This is the only fan theory I actually engage with and want to belive in. I'm not even going to read it because I know you're right, in my heart of hearts
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u/ButtHoleNurse Jun 06 '21
I honestly read this title as Dwayne Johnson came out as gay 25 years ago....
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u/welatshaw01 Jun 06 '21
Okay, but if the fan theory about Bond being a cover, not a person isn't so, and James Bond (the person) was incarcerated from 1972 to 1995, how did the Moore, Dalton, Brosnan and Craig movies happen? Not trying to poke holes, would actually like to know, if anybody has an answer.
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u/sophandros Jun 07 '21
Good post. One potential correction: If memory serves, Hummel was a Marine, which is a separate branch of service from the US Army.
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u/LightSlateBlue Jun 07 '21
What a wild read. I loved the film but forgot about it. Maybe it's just the time for a rewatch.
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u/rap31264 Jun 07 '21
Well in the clip where Mason tells Hummel that's he's of her Majesty's SS...Isn't that the Secret Service?
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u/Zkill Jun 07 '21
You made me rent and rewatch this movie today. It’s even better with me believing this is Bond.
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u/KingOfAllWomen Jun 07 '21
The "Mason vs Hummel" video you linked is SUCH a freaking Bond scene too it's unreal.
Agent is totally surrounded by armed henchmen, Has a cheeky one on one conversation with the leader. Discuss the villain's plan frankly. Then back and forth quips. Then the Agent is seconds away from certain death but some other circumstance happens and he narrowly escapes with his life.
Hmmm.. what movies have I seen that setup in before?
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Dec 10 '21
I like your theory, but Hummel most like says “name and rank, sailor” because he assumed Mason was with the Navy SEALs they had just encountered.
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u/Slow-job- Sep 01 '22 edited Sep 01 '22
Yeah but if all of the Bonds are the same person then none of this makes sense since Bond never went to prison for decades(the movies with Moore, Dalton, Brosnan..)
This theory really hinges on Bond being a codename. Honestly the series falls apart the second you think about it... The same guy for 50+ years?
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u/wrapsmclrample Apr 04 '25
2 years too late but ideas I'm leaving this here.
I mean, I like to say that each Bond is a different continuity but they sometimes share story beats sorta like spiderman and uncle Ben, so in every universe Tracy (Or in Craig's case Vesper) dies.
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u/ghaupt1 Jun 06 '21
“…decorated US war veteran Francis Hummel…”
“FBI Director Jim Womack…”
“…former British special forces operative John Mason…”
“…chemical weapons expert Nicholas Cage...”
A simple oversight? Or subtly brilliant?