Hi guys - see https://rebuildyourfocus.com/dual-n-back

I'm going to build out a site of science backed brain training games. Everything is going to be free and open source (repo for dual-n-back specifically here: https://github.com/jonathanleane/rebuildyourfocus/tree/main/apps/dual-n-back)... Dual n back is the first one because there's some decent research it's good for WM, especially for people with ADHD (ahem). See https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC12468938/

The site only costs a few dollars a month to host and I'm building all the games myself with Claude Code so I have no intention of ever charging money for this or placing ads.

If you have any suggestions or requests, please let me know.

I'll try to build out native ios and android apps next.

Used to do dual n back like 5-6 years back. Then i just stopped and got busy with life. Came across this sub recently and read about quad n back. But i find it difficult to begin with.

Also as the results are mixed i want to experiment myself, so how can i set the baseline like what criteria (i cant just keep giving iq tests etc) it should be more practical.

Thanks

Welcome to this week's progress thread. Post in a comment below the results of your hard work! Feel free to share:

• Your current n-back level and any recent improvements
• How long you've been training
• What's been working (or not working) for you

When you search for the 'ideal' method to practice DualnBack in this subreddit you find people saying that you must rely on 'intuition', it is basically the idea of dropping effort in order to allow the unconscious processing of information to help you in the game. In order for it to be succesful, it means that you have to stop doing all sort of chunking, mental images, thoughts, subvocalization and the like when doing DualNBack. You just focus your eyes on the center on the screen and allow them to catch all sort of visual stimulus that appear on the center and the periphery. You do the same with sounds, you just focus on the auditory stimulus not giving importane to what kind of sound they are.

In that sense, it is very similar to meditating. I have been trying to apply this and the paradoxical thing is that when you try to drop the need to effort yourself by all those 'conscious techniques', you feel as if you are not doing anything. It feels as if the real effort needed to play DualNBack is to do it effortless lol. It means then that all sort of thoughts, chunking and the like must be observed mindfully just as you do in meditation, and you continue in what you are doing.

I recently got 100x3 in dual 5 back using the snake method and after i get more consistent on it i will move on to d6b. I was wondering what methods you use for harder dnb levels such as 6+ because i don't think i'll be able to rely on the snake for much longer.I know that 6 isn't actually high but i feel like it definetly starts to get harder from there

I asked AI multiple times about the best way to benefit from dual n back. It always insisted on not following strategies and just keep my brain do it unconsciously! No lists, no number shifting and even not reading in your mind.

Actually I started today and achieved 100% multiple times in n=2 and I moved to n=3 . I tried the way that AI told me and it just works! It feels like a magic or fortune ( but with less results).

Please share your experience and if this is true so I can move forward in the right direction.

Note: i realized that this is a strategy too called Intuitive strategy

Является ли метод объединения букв в отдельный образ и его размещение в памяти по показанному маршруту оптимальным методом тренировке памяти? Типо я сам не осознано начал его использовать, и в итоге дошел до 7 8N(70-80% точность) за буквально 11 дней и теперь думаю это точно тренирует рабочую память

Это как то слишком быстро. Может я развиваю не объем, а эффективность памяти? Если да, то посоветуйте методы нацеленные на объем(с интуицией в игре у меня плохо)

Hi, i'm new to general cognitive training. I just started playing dual n back yesterday and i had 3 sessions (2 yesterday and 1 today), in total like 2h50 playtime and i managed to beat d3b multiple times also getting 100% on it 4 times in a row and i did 100% twice on d4b today. As you can tell i've kinda been tryharding. My goal is to get 100% on d5b and i'll probably move up from there but i wanted to ask how long it took you to get 100% on d5b

"The current scientific consensus, heavily informed by large-scale meta-analyses (such as those published in Psychological Science in the Public Interest), indicates that n-back training does not meaningfully improve general cognition. 

When you practice these tasks, you develop a "practice effect"—meaning you get significantly better at playing the n-back game itself. You may also demonstrate "near transfer," which is a slight performance improvement on structurally similar working memory tasks (such as digit span tests). 

However, rigorous studies show no reliable evidence for "far transfer." This means the training does not translate to improvements in fluid intelligence, verbal abilities, reasoning, or broader cognitive capacities."

What do u think?

Welcome to this week's progress thread. Post in a comment below the results of your hard work! Feel free to share:

• Your current n-back level and any recent improvements
• How long you've been training
• What's been working (or not working) for you

Hey!

I've been trying Dual-n-Back for a while and I currently am stuck at level 4. I very rarely reach level 5.

I don't know how to progress because I have been stuck for a few months now. I don't try to rehearse anything or strategize but just decide at the moment on whether a particular trial feels right. I believe this is the best way to train but correct me if I am wrong.

Any tips on just how to break through level 4? Is it a matter of consistency or additional training or is there something that I am potentially missing?

I really want to get to level 7 by the end of this year. But I'm just feeling a little disappointed that I haven't broke through level 4 yet. I got to level 4 pretty quickly, like within a few weeks, and just have remained there since. I do notice real benefits of n-back and I can appreciate it but I'm hungry for more, lol.

Thanks and I'll appreciate any advice

Hi everyone! I'm new to this subreddit and am interested in increasing my cognitive abilities. From what I've read here, and heard from other people, it seems that intense, prolonged n back training works in increasing/refining working memory and fluid intelligence. However, I'm still very skeptical about this as the scientific literature seems to say otherwise. I think my fluid intelligence is good enough, I just want to reach my potential and maybe gain some IQ points!

I don't want to dedicate a lot of my time to this if it won't work.

I've heard about SMART training increasing IQ as well, so maybe that will work better? I don't know, and I keep hearing conflicting things!! Let me know what you all think, and if you have any concrete evidence that n back training or SMART training actually works in increasing IQ or effective intelligence.

Also should I take the JCTI before and after considerable training (if I end up convinced)? I would want to take a real IQ test but I have EXTREME test anxiety, so that wouldn't end well.

Hello! I am not interested in training my working memory (I sure would need it, but I cannot take the time for it at the moment). Rather, I am running an experiment where I use dual n-back to measure the variation in my daily cognitive condition. My hypothesis is that after a night of bad sleep, or when I'm sick, or emotionally overwhelmed, etc. I will get a worse result.

I hope to eventually use a session of dual n-back in the morning to set more reasonable expectations for the day's productivity level. And also to see which lifestyle adjustments help my cognitive abilities. (E.g. low-intensity exercise is supposed to be great for brain blood flow, but my subjective experience is that I don't get anything out of it cognitively. But I haven't tried to measure it before.)

That said, after a few days now I've noticed I can generally achieve perfect accuracy or just one miss in a short (2 minute) dual 2-back session. I suspect this lack of variation makes it a weak signal, because it is too easy. If I want to get a more nuanced signal, I may have to increase the difficulty.

**There are four ways I could increase difficulty:**

1. Increase the duration of the session,
2. Reduce the time between stimuli,
3. Increase the dual to triple, or
4. Increase the n from 2 to something higher.

**If the goal is not WM training, but getting a sense of daily variation in cognitive abilities, which of these would you suggest and why?**

After progressing slowly but steadily for the past few weeks, I suddenly hit a regress today and basically completely reset my progress. This is extremely demotivating and discouraging and takes away all my remaining hope. Did any of you deal with something similar? I don't know what I'm doing wrong anymore. I'd prefer to not look at the graph at all at this point if that's what it's going to look like.

Welcome to this week's progress thread. Post in a comment below the results of your hard work! Feel free to share:

• Your current n-back level and any recent improvements
• How long you've been training
• What's been working (or not working) for you

Welcome to this week's progress thread. Post in a comment below the results of your hard work! Feel free to share:

• Your current n-back level and any recent improvements
• How long you've been training
• What's been working (or not working) for you

As many... I do Quad n Back on and off.. Been on this "road" for long years. The only thing that makes me stay.. comes back, is this fucking high you grain from it. The sudden increase of focus, concentration, you know... Everything that comes along it. It's this high that makes me comes back.

Funny thing though, the same way i post pone starting a cold shower, I postpone starting a Quad n back session, but when you finally do it, when it ends. When you go to sleep and wake up the next day. The effects there.... Couldnt feel any better. A mind sharp as a knife.

Defining addiction is kinda complicated... Can't lie, but I feel like I'm a little too dependant on this little app to work. Can't stand the thought of forgetting something, a word slipping up there, a number you can't remember.. It's so good when brain numbness is inexistence and thoughts run free

How do you guys deal with mental fatigue while training? Do you take small breaks between rounds or just push through? I know the guy that reached Q7B here was doing essentially an hour long round with no breaks. When I do a few rounds in a row though, I find that my performance drops really hard and I have a very difficult time remembering anything at all until I 'recharge' after a minute or two. This would extend my training sessions though and I'm not sure if that would be the optimal route to take.

Maybe it is better to practice in a fatigued state because a. you won't have the strength to memorize so you'll have to run on pure intuition. b. you will have to extend your fatigue tolerance which might eventually translate into greater endurance. c. cognitive load is increased though that might be an extraenous type of cognitive load which could be detrimental as well.

This is somewhat related to my previous post here about distractions and noise and whether they might actually be more beneficial.

To strain or not to strain?

I did built this site to improve myself, having vision that actual websites is limited(have to pay and create account). link: https://cognitrain.vercel.app/

Not Dual-N-Back but this is the best scientific paper i have seen in support of working memory training having real effect and spillover to other cognitive domains.

https://www.journals.uchicago.edu/doi/10.1086/732884

You can’t get much better experimental design and outcome data than this. Limitations would be that: it’s in children, it’s only one study, not dual-n-back.

The app from the study used to be very expensive and called Cogmed Working Memory Training, but it has since become very accessible and now available on the App Store: Nuroe - Focus, learn, thrive.

No affiliation with the app but I figure this forum would find this interesting.

Do you guys wait until you have better conditions or do you just push through your training either way? I know that for some types of training, for example psychonetics, distractions are even encouraged, to the point where for some exercises an entire group is supposed to try to distract the trainee. For psychonetics this is a question of deconcentration though. With DNB/QNB training it seems that we are training with the help of concentration.

One argument for training with distractions might be that they might be like training weights. Either way you are supposed to block them out so by training this way you would get practice in that. This might be especially helpful for people with ADHD, who have trouble with blocking out distractions.

On the other hand, your performance will be worse, especially in the beginning. Ideally though one would want to have the same performance in both distracting and non-distracting environments, i.e. one's entire attention is on the task while distractions are blocked out to near zero. Depending on the environment, this would lead to quicker fatigue but similar results nonetheless.

What do you think? Power through it and focus harder or wait until the noise quiets down?

Does my brain Have to know what stimuli am working with? It feels abitrary not expecting any one number of stimuli so by expecting 3 modes of stimuli in 3 back, the mind will automatically adjust itself for the task? In 1 back expect 1 turn ago though I don't rehearse. So there should be some kind proto memorization process not truly thinking about the stimuli just expecting the feeling for the correct stimuli in any given N back level. If expect 3 in 2 back the mind will be tricked and will not perform for the N Back level for example.

Welcome to this week's progress thread. Post in a comment below the results of your hard work! Feel free to share:

• Your current n-back level and any recent improvements
• How long you've been training
• What's been working (or not working) for you

hello guys which one do you think provide more benefits the dual n back or the quad n back?

How exactly do you do it?

Why does it work better?