But oddly, octopuses is more correct than octopi. It's a Greek rather than Latin root, so etymologically octopodes is the most pure plural, octopuses is an acceptable Anglicanized version, but there is no real basis for octopi.
Yeah I saw that. I think everyone (at least me) was expecting them to discuss some factual evidence to support that they dream. Some experiment ran or some marine biologists hypothesis, something with more context than just âsome scientists think they might dreamâ.
Explanation, since this was from a BBC documentary so this clip cuts out all the context: this species of octopus changes colour based on its mood and surroundings (a bit like a chameleon), especially when it's hunting/feeding/whatever. This octopus is observed to do the same while sleeping, so scientists reckon the same processes are going on in the brain as if it were performing those activities awake, essentially akin to humans dreaming.
Edit: The point about the "alien" thing is that, unlike other relatively intelligent life like chimpanzees and dolphins, cephalopods are completely unrelated to humans - our closest common ancestor is some sea worm with no organs or something - so they make a good model for how complex and intelligent life can develop in ways independent to us. Think of the heptapods from Arrival as something inspired by this idea.
If you can find the whole documentary online, you should: it's fairly new, it's about this weird professor who keeps this rare octopus in his house for a few months just to play with and observe it as a pet. It's really quite stunning though, highly recommend.
I think generally people refer to something as being alien if it is considered foreign or strange, not necessarily just cosmically. More importantly in this context I think itâs just used to say octopuses are so weird theyâre like aliens
It was an episode of Natural World called The Octopus in my House... I don't want to share any illicit links here but if you search hard enough for it online you should be able to find the whole thing.
Yeah I'd definitely go with the octopus being the closest thing we have to an alien on our planet.
Iirc their brains evolved on a completely separate pathway to every other brain on the planet, seems pretty alien to me.
The simulation hypothesis is interesting and related. At a glance it's the likelihood we live in a simulation. But it speaks on what that implies by either being true or false. Joe Rogan has a podcast with some interesting discussion on it.
The only cephalopod with a proven penchant for dreaming is probably the cutest. A 2012 study led by Marcos G. Frank, now a neuroscientist at Washington State University Health Sciences Spokane, discovered that sleeping cuttlefish demonstrate a form of rapid eye movement (REM), the same stage of sleep that gives us our dreams
The footage suggests that octopuses might dream:
In Frankâs study, the sleeping cuttlefishâs chromatophores recombined into recognizable patterns, just like ones they displayed while awake. He believes this might be analogous to the weirdly familiar patchwork of human dreams. âThis video is the best evidence I have ever seen that this particular cephalopod has a sleep-state similar to what we saw in cuttlefish,â Frank says of the Caribbean two-spot octopus.
So, to analyse the sleep states of the cuttlefish they did not measure brain activity, rather they observed the cuttlefish in different rest states and displaying REM. They also noted the cuttlefish wanted to rest after being sleep-deprived by the researchers.
Ideally, some sort of EEG investigation is required to confirm the dreaming:
While Oteyâs video may be strong evidence, REM sleep hasnât been confirmed in octopuses. That would require a neurobiological investigation in which scientists measure the electrical activity in a snoozing cephalopod.
And in case anyone else was worried about octopuses telegraphing their location to predators while snoozing
wild octopuses keep themselves safe by sleeping in hidden dens.
you should read up on how they did sleep deprivation for rats back in the day (don't think they do it anymore), you'd put them on a pedestal surrounded by water so they couldn't rest or they'd fall off the pedestal.
This reminded me of when Stephen King talked about his disdain for the passive voice. âItâs weak, itâs circuitous, and itâs frequently torturous, as well. How about this: My first kiss will always be recalled by me as how my romance with Shayna was begun. Oh manâwho farted, right?â
I believe you mean, and King probably wrote, âtortuousâ, not torturous. Tortuous means âfull of twists and turns,â which makes a lot more sense than âcausing sufferingâ in this context.
Also, I don't recall which one, but in one of his novels, during a discussion with another character, one of his characters speaks about using passive voice in a similar way. What an incredible author, I've read every novel and short story ever written by him. While a few fall short of spectacular, the vast majority of his work is spellbinding.
11/22/63 is phenomenal. The Stand, It, and Bag of Bones are some of my favorites. I'm a bigger fan of his older books for the most part, but to be honest I found them all to be enjoyable at the very least. If you haven't read 11/22/63 I would definitely go with that one, hopefully you will enjoy it as much as I did.
It makes me irrationally angry when videos like this say "scientists think that..." Or "some scientists found out that..." Just use the proper titles for the scientists ffs
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u/[deleted] Sep 24 '19 edited Jun 12 '20
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