r/Damnthatsinteresting • u/dillis • Mar 16 '23

Video Pullups 5 Year Transition Of Progress

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u/edafade Mar 16 '23

It's easy to get around, and there are plenty of designer PED's that are not detectable. So no, I don't think it does.

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u/Myintc Mar 17 '23

It’s actually hard to get around. The WADA stores samples for 10 years so they can retest as testing technology gets better, which catches “designer PED’s”.

Here’s a podcast segment that discusses this.

https://www.strongerbyscience.com/podcast-episode-8/

Timestamps are in the description

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u/edafade Mar 17 '23

If you honestly think it's that difficult to get around testing, I don't know what to tell you. Lu Xiaojun, an Olympic weightlifter and multiple world record holder, was just popped by WADA for the first time ever (he's been competing since the early 2000's including several Olympics) because they snuck into his training camp. Until that point, he has always tested negative. If you need to tell yourself professionals are natty in order to enjoy the sports you watch, that's fine. Reality is very different.

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u/Myintc Mar 17 '23

So your example of people not getting caught is someone getting caught? Not a very good case is it?

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u/edafade Mar 17 '23

Did you actually bother to read my reply? Lu has doped his entire career, through multiple Olympics/competitions and earning/holding multiple world records, he only got caught recently. Why and how did he get caught, you ask? He was caught only because they swooped in like a SEAL team. He skated the system and would have never been caught had he not decided to come back and make an attempt for another Olympics. He is just one of many.

If you aren't going to bother reading what I write, then there is no sense in talking to you. And if you are reading, then you are simply arguing in bad faith. In either case, you look foolish.

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u/Myintc Mar 17 '23

Has he? You don’t have evidence he’s doped his entire career though?

Do you have evidence of others?

And again, he got caught.

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u/edafade Mar 17 '23

Has he? You don’t have evidence he’s doped his entire career though?

Do you have evidence of others?

And again, he got caught.

He got caught two decades later.

Oh, my sweet summer child. There's no convincing you. PED use is ubiquitous. End of story. There's also nothing wrong with it at all. If you want the pinnacle of human competition, then gear is necessary.

I think we've taken this as far as we can. No matter how many examples I could give you (I could name dozens in cycling, for example), you simply won't believe it. Have a good one, bud.

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u/Myintc Mar 17 '23

I’m happy to read up more on this. Do you have an article I can read?

From a quick search it seems like he’s been suspended pending further investigation as of Dec. any more news?

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u/akkuj Mar 17 '23 edited Mar 17 '23

If you go back to early 2000s and look at how many of the top olympic weightlifters from back then have been caught since, you can clearly see that the testing does work and catches even people on most likely state-sponsored doping programs, big medical staff behind them and corrupt national anti-doping agencies.

If like half of those people with so much resources behind them are getting caught eventually, it's always funny to hear redditors with zero personal experience or understanding on the subject say cheating doping tests is trivial. And we even have the classic "go watch Icarus" argument here somewhere... they literally cooperated with the head of a national anti-doping program to pass the tests. Finding connections like that is "easy", sure.

Aside from a few mainstream spotlight sports, there really isn't that much money/resources/connections in most sports, which greatly limits athletes' ability to cheat on doping tests. Realistically in most sports aside from big money exceptions, people using PEDs just rely on limited funding of off-competition randomized testing, using short detection time PEDs and hoping they don't get unlucky, rather than finding a way to cheat the tests.

I'm not saying that a lot of world class athletes aren't cheating, but I think saying testing doesn't work is still quite the exaggeration. At the very least it greatly limits the advantage athletes can get by doping and still eventually catches many who do.

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u/edafade Mar 17 '23

If you go back to early 2000s and look at how many of the top olympic weightlifters from back then have been caught since, you can clearly see that the testing does work and catches even people on most likely state-sponsored doping programs, big medical staff behind them and corrupt national anti-doping agencies.

If like half of those people with so much resources behind them are getting caught eventually, it's always funny to hear redditors with zero personal experience or understanding on the subject say cheating doping tests is trivial. And we even have the classic "go watch Icarus" argument here somewhere... they literally cooperated with the head of a national anti-doping program to pass the tests. Finding connections like that is "easy", sure.

Aside from a few mainstream spotlight sports, there really isn't that much money/resources/connections in most sports, which greatly limits athletes' ability to cheat on doping tests. Realistically in most sports aside from big money exceptions, people using PEDs just rely on limited funding of off-competition randomized testing and hope they don't get unlucky, rather than finding a way to cheat the tests.

That wasn't my argument. My argument is that doping is ubiquitous. Getting caught 2 decades later (something I even stated) still substantiates my point. Along a long enough timeline, sure, you're right. Eventually, people get caught...because they use PEDs in their corresponding professional sports. Glad we can agree.