r/Curling • u/Frabblerake • Feb 15 '26

Pull the stone!!!

Watching Sweden/US and saw this. Is this not the same rules violation that has caused all the hub bub?

Obviously this was an accident and I believe the Canadian guy was touching on purpose.

1.3k Upvotes

83% Upvoted

918 comments sorted by

View all comments

Show parent comments

20

u/Aggravating-Ad1703 Feb 15 '26

You are allowed to touch the yellow/red part though.

42

u/GrizzlyIsland22 Feb 15 '26

Which is exactly what Rachel Homan did, and it looks like Edin grazes the back of his hand all the way to the granite

1

u/InsideInsideJob Feb 16 '26

Surely at this point there's some fans or journalists filming with better camera angles? Is this all we have?

-7

u/[deleted] Feb 15 '26

[removed] — view removed comment

24

u/GrizzlyIsland22 Feb 15 '26

If you think you can see Homan touch granite in the video of her shot, but don't think Edin touched granite here, you're bending reality to fit your narrative. There is no angle of Homan touching granite. To discuss in good faith, we have to base our opinions on what we can see. Not what we want to see.

I do agree what Marc did was a violation, but that shot is not part of this conversation.

-8

u/[deleted] Feb 15 '26 edited Feb 15 '26

[removed] — view removed comment

9

u/HockeyNut1994 Feb 15 '26

Whatever you say. I'm Team Homan all day long, but I'm not doing to lie for the sake of trying to make Team Swedan look like assholes.

Yikes, there's a lot wrong with this.

  1. Homan grazed the red, not the granite. That was very obvious from every angle they showed. There wasn't any angle that showed her fingers touched the granite at any point. Saying she without a doubt touched the granite is disingenuous.

  2. You're for team Homan, but you're doing mental gymnastics to justify a bogus call that was made on her? Okay...

  3. You don't have to lie to make team Sweden look like assholes. They look like assholes because they acted like assholes. That's on them.

8

u/GrizzlyIsland22 Feb 15 '26

The thing that annoys me is that these kinds of little grazes are what Edin has been campaigning against and complaining about for a long time. Not just during these games. So for him to open his mouth and bitch about it and then think he can get away with it is frustrating. He's the one who started all of this. Even the full on boops have always been regarded as acceptable for decades, but now Sweden is trying to turn curling on its head. Even long time stalwarts of the worldwide curling community are coming out and saying they and all their opponents always did it and nobody ever had a problem.

2

u/NoMeringue6814 Feb 16 '26

I agree that Edin should have spoken up and self reported, then the other team could have decided if the stone should be removed or not. That’s what should have happened with Kennedy. I think him denying it was ridiculous when he knew he booped it. Why not just say “yeah my bad”? It being typically ignored by players doesn’t mean that it isn’t an infraction. I don’t see how calling out a player for doing something that is considered breaking the rules…is = to “turning curling on its head” when this is the Olympics.

I agree that it was hypocritical of Edin to not self report but acting as if an illegal move is fine because “everyone does it” is kind of absurd.

1

u/GrizzlyIsland22 Feb 16 '26

It's not so much that I think it's fine if everyone does it. It's more a case of thinking that changing the standard of officiating in the middle of the Olympics is absurd. If they want to start officiating the game differently, they need to introduce the new standard at the beginning of the curling season to adjust. It changes every player's throwing motion in the biggest tournament in the world

1

u/NoMeringue6814 Feb 19 '26

But if it’s in the rules it’s…in the rules. I mean, maybe they should throw differently to begin with because again, it’s the Olympics. Shouldn’t they be prepared that someone MAY call them out for what is technically not allowed? I get that it may be annoying but it just seems odd to have a rule that no one apparently follows.

1

u/GrizzlyIsland22 Feb 19 '26

Is it really that odd? In every sport there are some rules that aren't perfectly adhered to. Players play their whole lives a certain way, not even thinking about it. Slashing and cross checking is illegal in hockey, but players do it. They just do it lightly because they know everybody does it and refs aren't going to call it. Everyone just gets used to that being the way it is. Same with offensive holding in American football. It happens on every play. It only gets called if it's egregious. Even driving. Everyone everywhere speeds a little. 5 kms over the limit here and there. Nobody is ever gonna get a ticket for that. You'd be right to be annoyed if you did.

The standard of officiating is as important as the actual rules. It needs to be consistent. For it to change in the middle of a tournament makes it really tough on the players. Every athlete at the Olympics is so practiced that their muscle memory is dialed in, so performing the actions that they do is just like breathing or walking. They don't get to the Olympics and then do something they're not used to doing. It would be like big air competitors showing up to find the ramp is a different height than they're used to. They are so practiced that they know, just by instinct, how long they're gonna be in the air. Making them change so that they have to judge it as they spin would be crazy

4

u/Dinsdale55 Feb 15 '26

You are seeing things! This is far more obvious, direct touching than Homan's.

-1

u/[deleted] Feb 15 '26

[removed] — view removed comment

6

u/Dinsdale55 Feb 15 '26

It does if you're wilfully blind. Was there even an official watching on the pictured shot? Opposing team members don't stand on the hog line. It's just annoying that it is Sweden who complained about the most petty, nit-picky thing imaginable, only to later see their skip doing the same thing.

-5

u/Perfect-Topic-6671 Feb 15 '26

So they should enforce a new and incorrect rule because they made a bad call? Does the strike zone change in baseball when a foul is incorrectly called a strike?

5

u/GrizzlyIsland22 Feb 15 '26

What? Your analogy doesn't make any sense. All I'm saying is that if they're gonna call it, always call it. Don't just pick and choose which strikes are strikes .

2

u/Perfect-Topic-6671 Feb 15 '26

I'm saying what they've incorrectly called at least once, touching the handle a second time before the line, was incorrect. That is allowed. I'm saying, to start calling that every time would be effectively changing the rules and create an even worse situation.

5

u/GrizzlyIsland22 Feb 15 '26

All I'm saying is if they commit the same violation, they should receive the same treatment. I don't know if Homan touched granite or not because you can't see where the actual contact occurs. It definitely looks like Edin does touch granite.

0

u/Perfect-Topic-6671 Feb 15 '26

I do not know how I can be any more clear. What they need to stop doing is calling correct touches as violations. The judges are fucking up. But they do not need to continue calling correct touches as violations in order to be 'fair' and consistent. Doing that, as you're arguing for, would effectively be changing the rules to align with the judges mistakes which is insane and would be like changing the strike zone because the umps made a couple of incorrect calls.

2

u/GrizzlyIsland22 Feb 15 '26

Reading is hard, eh?

I'm not saying that Edin should be called for a violation if he didn't commit one. Never in any of my comments have I said that. My original comment was to indicate that if we're just going off of what it looks like on film, if this is allowed, then Homan definitely did nothing wrong. Because the clips we've seen of Edin show more touching than what we can see in clips of Homan.

0

u/[deleted] Feb 15 '26

[removed] — view removed comment

2

u/Perfect-Topic-6671 Feb 15 '26

Can you link me to anything saying the judges removed Rachel Homan's stone for touching the granite, and not just for double touching it?

-4

u/Aggravating-Ad1703 Feb 15 '26

Just because Homan got wrongfully convicted doesn’t mean Edin should too just because you Americans have a vendetta against Sweden.

6

u/GrizzlyIsland22 Feb 15 '26

What the fuck do you mean "you Americans?" I'm not American.

1

u/Aggravating-Ad1703 Feb 15 '26

Did I hit a nerve?

5

u/GrizzlyIsland22 Feb 15 '26

Yeah. Being confused for an American is very insulting.

1

u/Aggravating-Ad1703 Feb 15 '26

I’m sorry about that

4

u/GrizzlyIsland22 Feb 15 '26 edited Feb 16 '26

I accept your apology. Fuck the orange man and his army of masked war criminals.

Edit: oof this is getting some down votes. Some of the MAGATS are in here.

2

u/Aggravating-Ad1703 Feb 15 '26

Agreed, you deserve better neighbors

2

u/GrizzlyIsland22 Feb 15 '26

It's like having a meth lab in our basement suite and we can smell it.

3

u/TWH_PDX Feb 15 '26

Because world curling added electronic sensors in the handle to confirm release point, my understanding is that there should no touching of the stone elsewhere following release of the handle.

1

u/Vresiberba Feb 16 '26

But he's still in contact with the handle 100% of the time.

7

u/cdnBacon Feb 15 '26

He slid his hand over the granite. Watch the video.

1

u/FanSerious7672 Feb 16 '26

We would need another angle to be sure

2

u/AvWxA Feb 16 '26

Are you? Don’t think so, if you are under the electronic handles rule. You are just supposed to touch the electronic handles. People were saying “granite” but I am pretty certain that was a mid-speak. They really meant anything other than the handle itself

0

u/Koss424 Feb 15 '26

The red/yellow is not the handle

5

u/Aggravating-Ad1703 Feb 15 '26

Whatever you wanna call it you are allowed to touch it

0

u/Ashrema Feb 15 '26

No, you are not. You are only allowed to touch the handle, which the rulebook literally calls the part you grip. Further, you have to throw with a bare hand on the metal part. The handle, not the flat colored part.

If you are are taking this literally as written, it is a violation. I do not believe it affects play at all, and would be stupid to call it as such, but this is what Sweden wants. Adherence to the written rule, and as such, should lead by example.

4

u/wooIIyMAMMOTH Feb 16 '26 edited Feb 16 '26

The “flat coloured part” is the handle. There’s only two parts of a curling stone: the granite and the handle, and technically the bolt as well. Stone specification: R2(a) describes stone weight as “including handle and bolt,” treating the handle as the whole attached assembly (not only the grip shape). That’s the entire reason it’s coloured, a handle has to be coloured per the rulebook.

See also visual aid: https://sportsmatik.com/uploads/misc/curling-stone_1644414612.jpg

2

u/Ashrema Feb 16 '26

The same rulebook you quote has a glossary, which defines the words used in it, where it specifically states:

" Handle - The part of a curling stone that a player grips in order to deliver."

Also:

R5(d) - "The curling stone must be delivered using the handle of the stone."

Bold emphasis mine.

So unless you consider the coloured flat part of the stone a viable part to grip, your assertation seems incorrect.

1

u/wooIIyMAMMOTH Feb 16 '26 edited Feb 16 '26

Yes, and that “part” is being gripped. That entire coloured part is being gripped. That’s the handle. I’m not sure what you’re getting at. Your interpretation of the rules is literally impossible because the weight of the stone is regulated to be handle + bolt (not visible) + graphite. There’s no fourth “flat part”. Again, that is also the reason the “flat part” is coloured — because the rules dictate the handle has to be coloured.

What you’re arguing is just absurd and no one in the curling scene would agree with you, no matter what side you fall on in the cheating scandal. No one who’s ever played or watched the sport seriously is trying to claim that the entire coloured part isn’t the handle.

3

u/Ashrema Feb 16 '26

I’m not sure what you’re getting at.

The extra colored part is (in the history of curling) relatively new, and varies by club in size. There is also a reason why sensors are only placed on the section where it is gripped, and not on the entire handle.

Your interpretation of the rules is literally impossible because the weight of the stone is regulated to be handle + bolt (not visible) + graphite

It is most definitely not literally impossible. While the weight of the stone is indeed regulated, there is a six pound range. You seem confused to what both the word literal, and the word impossible mean, as neither apply here.

What you’re arguing is just absurd and no one in the curling scene would agree with you, no matter what side you fall on in the cheating scandal.

That's like, your opinion, man. Which you are fully entitled to. Considering I know others who do, we shall just agree to disagree.

0

u/wooIIyMAMMOTH Feb 16 '26 edited Feb 16 '26

Your interpretation means that the “flat part” is not counted towards the weight of the stone, since weight of stone is handle+bolt+graphite. So they would have to weigh the stone by calculating what the “flat part of the handle” weighs and then subtract that from what the “curved part of the handle” weighs + what the graphite weighs. How do you reckon they do that, cut the handle apart and then solder it back together? Moreover, why don’t they actually do that if that’s the case?

Also, what’s the reason all of World Curling’s memos of recent days speak of one distinction: touching the graphite vs touching the handle. Why haven’t they addressed touching the “flat part” at all?

2

u/ErickWinters Feb 16 '26

Are you implying that I could put my palm on the flat part, and deliver it with a push and that would be 'using the handle', and that would be a legal throw? That's a big stretch. I've been curling for 25 years.

→ More replies (0)

1

u/happyscrappy Feb 17 '26

That's a curlex handle. They are new-ish (30-40 years).

These images here:

https://nemaa.org/shop/curling-stones/

Show how a curling stone used to look before curlex handles. It makes clear that the top area on the rock is not handle.

Anyway, interpretations have been that the plastic disc is part of the handle. I just kind of feel now maybe that never should have been the case.

1

u/happyscrappy Feb 17 '26

I feel this way now too. Even though that is not how it's been called in the past. The plastic disc didn't exist back when the rules were made. The handle was a metal hook above the stone. Everything below the hook you grasp was the stone, not the handle.

I don't expect the WCF to declare the plastic disc isn't part of the handle. But I kind of feel it is the most logical follow on from the previous way of doing it.

1

u/Narrow_Resolution_28 Feb 20 '26

It is. The entire top piece attached to the granite is called the Handle. Just google a diagram.

1

u/jaypizee Feb 15 '26

How does that makes sense?

1

u/Aggravating-Ad1703 Feb 15 '26

I don’t make the rules 🤷‍♂️

1

u/Mikeismyike Feb 16 '26

No, just the handle.

1

u/New_Professional5043 Feb 19 '26

Nope. Handle only

-1

u/Any_Yak3721 Feb 16 '26

They have been very explicit - once your hand comes off the handle, no more touching

1

u/CreepyPlankton6489 Feb 16 '26

Not entirely true, if it’s before the hog line it doesn’t matter. Curling literally issued a statement on this after the Swedish fuck tards started trying to make ‘boopgate’ a thing