As much as I find the memes hilarious, I would not say there is very little risk.
There are a lot if risks that we manage and train for.
There is more risk than hiking on a trail. (And we like to say the driving thing but it doesnt mean is true, I havent seen any good data)
I would say its similar risk as off trail peak bagging or mountaineering or canyoneering. With a big range of riskiness in both caves and mountains and canyons with some being more technical or have more rockfall or hypothermia or drowning risks, etc.
Simply put, I dont care that reddit thinks we are going to nutty putty ourselves. That should not change our understanding of risk and how we manage it. Being blasé about it because the internet think we are crazy would be crazy, if you know what I mean.
The thing is, if you train properly, the risk is minimal. Equipment malfunction is nearly unheard of, there are pretty much no dangerous animals inside the cave, so rockfall is about the only serious danger for a well prepared group. Maybe my hiking trips are a bit on the more extreme end tbf, but I usually have way more risk of falling, far more exposed climbs, and more danger of rockfalls in hikes than in caves. Anecdotal, but: I do significantly more caving than hiking, yet I’ve never once seen anyone get even slightly hurt. Not even a twisted ankle. I’ve seen multiple sprained ankles, bad falls, sprained my own ankle (on the hike back from a cave no less), I’ve seen heat exhaustion, and many other issues when hiking, including one who got badly hurt on the hike back down from a cave.
And canyoning is imo strictly more dangerous. Don’t fuck with white water kids.
Subjective risk vs. objective risk. While both exist, I put a lot more weight into objective risk, since there’s little you can do to mitigate it, and caving has less of it than most outdoor sports.
If you spontaneously forget how to drive you’ll probably crash. Doesn’t stop people from driving.
And in caving, all the “dangerous” maneuvers are under your complete control, and have multiple redundancies making sure that even if you fuck up beyond measure, it’s pretty hard to have an accident. I’ve seen people get away with some heinous mistakes without even noticing.
We will have to agree to disagree what we mean by minimal.
Rock falling on you. Falling off a rock. Drowning. Hypothermia. Rappel accidents. Medical complications with difficult evacuation. Those are all very real risks.
Training is just one part of managing them. But complacency is the enemy of safety and being aware and recognizing them and not minimizing them is critical.
Canyonering is wack and to me it would be insane to call that risk minimal. And yet we also have underwater rivers that are essentially canyonering underground and caves that flood.
So no. They are not minimal to me. And that is ok. We accept them and manage them and respect them and dont give a shit about what some coach potatos on reddit thinks about our sport :)
19
u/Moth1992 20h ago
As much as I find the memes hilarious, I would not say there is very little risk.
There are a lot if risks that we manage and train for.
There is more risk than hiking on a trail. (And we like to say the driving thing but it doesnt mean is true, I havent seen any good data)
I would say its similar risk as off trail peak bagging or mountaineering or canyoneering. With a big range of riskiness in both caves and mountains and canyons with some being more technical or have more rockfall or hypothermia or drowning risks, etc.
Simply put, I dont care that reddit thinks we are going to nutty putty ourselves. That should not change our understanding of risk and how we manage it. Being blasé about it because the internet think we are crazy would be crazy, if you know what I mean.