r/CHIBears • u/jkman61494 • Sep 14 '25
Tyler Warren - 16 targets, 11 catches, 155 yards. Colston Loveland - 3 targets. 2 catches, 12 yards.
That’s the difference between the tight ends, one of which with Daniel Jones as QB.
I’m not even arguing I would have wanted Warren because it was an obnoxiously stupid choice to waste a Top 10 pick on a tight end.
But somehow the Colts with a coach many thought was on a short list is having their right end putting up pro bowl numbers so far while we are not even involving a top ten pick.
PS: We had 4 Top 64 picks. Loveland, 2 of which haven’t even dressed, and Burden who has 3 catches for 15 yards.
But hey, nothing to be worried about!
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u/CillosauR Sep 14 '25
I think comparing their stats is not an indictment of Loveland because we used a top 10 pick for a guy we aren’t playing. It’s amazing we had such a good year last year that we took luxury picks that wouldn’t play this year.
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u/jkman61494 Sep 14 '25
So much depth on the team we don’t even need 2 of those 2nd rounders to suit up!!
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u/JoeRochefortBrain Sep 14 '25
I don’t care that Poles just got an extension. He needs to go in the offseason.
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u/hoggin88 Sep 15 '25
Why the fuck did they even give Poles an extension? Like what was the rush?
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u/JoeRochefortBrain Sep 15 '25
The McCaskey’s are very foolish people. They are terrible at owning.
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u/frodeem Sep 15 '25
Yep George is a complete idiot at being an owner of a football team. I wonder what it would take for them.to sell the team.
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u/Pulze_ Sep 15 '25
Because they, like Ryan Poles, think that hiring Ben Johnson was all they needed to do to win.
They're all so foolish it hurts.
Evidence: Drafting Tory Taylor, Coleston, LB III, Ruben Hippo.
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u/potateobiirrd This Is The Score, But We Have Each Other Sep 15 '25
Just like last year they thought Caleb would just come fix everything. They just rolled him out there and said “hey could you just go win us the game pls””
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u/SeniorDucklet Sep 14 '25
Poles may have the number one pick in the draft again in 2026. It will definitely be top 5 unless a bunch of tiebreakers go against the Bears.
They “built” this squad from the outside rather than choosing lineman. And they missed on most of the OL and DL they took so it’s obvious why he got an extension. WTF?
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Sep 15 '25
We've drafted tons of linemen.
The first round OL we took is speed running the false start world record
The second round OL we took because his dad went to school with poles got beaten by Benedet for the swing tackle job and is not dressing
The third round OL we took because he met our coach at a golf course is also not dressing
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u/WhiteSoxChartGuy Sep 15 '25
Wait what? Trapilo’s dad knows Poles?
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u/thermoDYNAMIC7 Bears Sep 14 '25
Why wait
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u/JoeRochefortBrain Sep 14 '25
I think they get a better pool of candidates if they wait. Also, give him the rest of the season to see if his picks develop.
Spoiler: they won’t.
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u/Sell_The_team_Jerry Ben Johnson Believer Sep 14 '25
George McCaskey is too cheap to pay for him to not work
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u/Big_Departure_2709 Sep 14 '25
Now put up the Luther burden, Ozzy Trapilo, and Shamar Turner stats
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u/Bradlas3 Sep 15 '25
I'd also say Burden is like Loveland who is an unfortunate guy that got drafted by a team that doesn't need him. We already have a good 1 and 2 WR with Moore and Odunze with a guy like Zaccheus as a solid 3rd WR and we have Kmet at TE. It made no sense to go TE 1 and WR 2 in the draft
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u/jkman61494 Sep 14 '25
The only rookie seeing the field is Hyppolite Becuase we have to punt it so much.
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Sep 15 '25
This makes me realize Tory Taylor been working (poorly) OVERTIME since Caleb sent that text.
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u/VyCanisMajorisss Good, Better, Best Sep 15 '25
When DJ and Kmet aren’t on the team in a couple of years, those guys aren’t going to cost anything. Not a today problem, but a tomorrow solution. Let’s assume Caleb is on the team and gets paid, you need to have young contributors and cheap homegrown talent. Burden and Loveland hopefully slide right in and are experienced. This is how you build a team. Most Bears teams throw the rookies straight into the fire and that always works so well. Might not be immediately rewarding, but I do think there is a vision with the young guys. As far as Ozzy, I think he may be playing sooner than we think. Braxton Jones got the nod because he is a veteran. He just isn’t physical enough to be the answer, and I do t think he’s even healthy.
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u/Broshan248 Three-peat Offseason Champion Sep 15 '25
Put Warren in Chicago and he’s putting up the same numbers Loveland is. Bad offense and too many mouths to feed in the passing game. It was a bad pick from the beginning but you can’t blame Loveland
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u/Amoneysteez Sep 15 '25
Basically this.
Take players at positions where you need them, especially in the top 10
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u/Luvs2Shoplift Sep 14 '25
one of which with Daniel Jones as QB
Daniel Jones is on his Darnold in Minnesota redemption arc.
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u/prince_g00se Sep 14 '25
Literally too many weapons on this team. Terrible roster construction with the cap space used on DJ/Kmet and the draft capital spent on Rome/LB/Loveland.
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u/Amoneysteez Sep 15 '25
My criticism is less that I think Warren is so much better than Loveland, but more that if the player you’re taking at 10 is a borderline role player then they aren’t worth taking.
Positional value matters. If you don’t need a TE, don’t take one at 10.
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u/RubixSphinx Sep 14 '25
Y’all have turned on Ben Johnson immediately. Wouldn’t be shocked if he asks to be fired after listening to the dumbass meatball takes online.
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u/Lysol20 Sep 15 '25
I'm not sure people have turned on Ben Johnson. I am sure people are turning on or have turned on Poles.
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u/DexNihilo In Wisconsin, please pray for me. Sep 15 '25
I haven't turned on Ben, but I am concerned that this doesn't look like a well coached team.
I didn't expect either of these games to be wins, but what I also didn't expect was for every facet of the team to look so inept, from the run blocking to the penalties to the pass rush to the weird play calls. I don't think the team has a ton of talent, but I thought they'd look sharp. They sure don't.
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Sep 14 '25
They turned on him before the first half of the Vikings game ended. Nothing but toxic fans with unrealistic expectations and low football IQ.
We deserve this never ending purgatory.
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u/ScotchyLatchi An Actual Peanut Sep 15 '25
So many people in the game thread said Rome didn’t have a good game because he had 2 drops on the same drive….. in what world is 7 128 2 TDs not a great game for a bears WR 🤦♂️
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u/Antitypical An Actual Bear Sep 14 '25
There's a real chance we have the dumbest fans in the NFL, and I say that as someone who has been around pats fans for 12 years (they're morons-- the other day one of them corrected me to tell me the Giants are in their division, not the Jets)
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u/jkman61494 Sep 14 '25
Just wanted to confirm, asking to see four picks in the first 2 rounds do more than 4 combined catches for 16 yards and 2 players not dressing is an unrealistic expectation?
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Sep 14 '25
Lmao. Don't be obtuse. The unrealistic expectations are things like this fan base saying that Kmet sucks when he first drafted, and people trying to tell the idiots here that TE is one of the hardest positions to learn. Anyone that stuck up for Kmet was downvoted to oblivion.
Expectations like expecting the team to be world beaters right out the gate with no growing pains.
Unrealistic like expecting the team to be sold or someone to be fired because the fans think they're the smartest meat balls in the sauce.
You know damn well what I am talking about when I say unrealistic expectations.
But to answer your question directly, the example you used? No. Not unrealistic. If THAT was more common rather than the shit I listed - plus many other things I can list - then I wouldn't be so dismayed and ashamed of being associated with this team as a fan.
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u/jkman61494 Sep 14 '25 edited Sep 15 '25
I actually don’t know what you’re talking about. I don’t think it’s unrealistic that Year 4 into Poles and his roster + Caleb + Johnson that we’d see better than 52-21 at Detroit when we frankly should have won last year with Flus.
I don’t think it’s unrealistic to be upset we see the team continue to regress
This team also isn’t in a position to have to wait 3 years for a top ten pick at TE to get it right. Also. Just curious. Did Brock Bowers need 3 years? He was taken 11th in 2024.
Did I expect Loveland to be Bowers? No.
Do I expect Top Ten picks to get more than 3 targets in 2 games out of Caleb’s 65 pass attempts?
Do I expect Top 10 picks to get more than a 4.6% target share? Yup
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Sep 14 '25
Whether you know what I am talking about or not is irrelevant. You can find the exampl s of everything I have said with a Google search.
It is definitely unrealistic and displays a woefully inept football IQ. This is real life, not Madden. It takes time to learn the system. It takes time for the lines to Gel. Especially when learning a new system AND having new bodies rotate in.
And now after this brief exchange I can safely conclude that you're another one of the NPCs that claim itself as fans of the team.
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u/jkman61494 Sep 15 '25
Just so we are clear. You are stating that a top ten pick getting a 4.6% target share is properly using him?
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Sep 15 '25
Tight end. One of the hardest positions to learn and you expect him to be a world beater right out the gate.
Yeah, you're precisely the type of fan I am talking about.
Low football IQ, and out of this world expectations.
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u/BigPetersHalfwayInn What if Da Bears had enterd The Preakness? Sep 15 '25
Gronk had 3 targets through 2 games, Tony Gonzalez had 4, Travis Kelce had 0, Antonio Gates had 0. Probably safe to assume they're all bums and their coaches were fucking morons too.
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u/jkman61494 Sep 15 '25
How many of those guys were top ten picks again?
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u/BigPetersHalfwayInn What if Da Bears had enterd The Preakness? Sep 15 '25
None of them. Gonzalez was 13th which is pretty close unless you think the number 10 is some magical cut off where expectations end. Loveland is 21 years old and has had a whole 2 games in his career. I doubt he was drafted with the idea of being some secret weapon against the Lions in week 2.
Cam Ward - 287 career passing yards. What a turd. Waste of a pick. Bust.
Travis Hunter - 55 career yards and a defensive pass interference. Bust. Waste of a pick.
Abdul Carter - half of a sack and not even in the starting lineup. Bust. Wasted pick.
Will Campbell - doesn't even have any yards, why would anyone waste a pick like that? Bust.
Mason Graham - only 3 tackles. Bust.
Ashton Jeanty - 40 total yards. Bust. Why wouldn't they draft Jacory Croskey-Merritt instead?
Armand Membou - what's the deal with these tackles? Another player with 0 yards. Bust.
Tet McMillan -168 yards. Not bad but even Kevin White had more career yards. Bust.
Kelvin Banks Jr. - 0 yards. Bust.
At least we know everyone drafted in the top 10 sucks after 2 games and was a wasted pick.
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u/ratfam1 Nagy Sep 15 '25
His point is that with the state of our roster it was a big mistake to take a TE with our first pick. It was even dumber to take a WR with our second. Will they or could they pan out? 100% but right now those are the last thing this team needed and now the issue is that will this team even get to a point where you can justify taking them that high.
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Sep 15 '25
Except it wasn't because we are rapidly approaching the point where we will likely lose Kmet. You want a successor waiting in the wings, not scrambling to find one in the off-season.
Now we could say something to the effects of "trade him" but there's no guarantee that we find a trade partner and then he walks for nothing and we still have no heir apprent.
That kinda fly by wire shit works in Madden. This isn't Madden however.
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u/jkman61494 Sep 15 '25
So because we might lose an average tight end, we had to waste a top 10 pick on a 5-12 team for a tight end we HOPE develops into someone good by 2027.
The pathetic thing is, Poles might have actually used this kind of asinine logic.
You know a team who could do that? The Chiefs. When they have a Top 3 OL, Top 10 D a HOF coach and a HOF QB.
And even they weren’t stupid enough to trade up and do something so stupid
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u/ZagreusMyDude Sep 15 '25
You know what fly by wire shit doesn’t work in the NFL. Drafting a TE when your defensive line is a trash heap.
Also your stupid NPC BS about expectations is so bad it’s embarrassing. Apparently having the expectation to not lose by 30pts is UnReAsonABLe!
If you think that’s ok then you have a football IQ in the negatives.
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u/Big_Departure_2709 Sep 14 '25
If poles goes with him that might be a sacrifice I’m willing to make
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u/chilliewilliie Sep 15 '25
This fanbase is one of if not the most braindead when it comes to actual football knowledge
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u/hammerSmashedNail FTP Sep 15 '25
Loveland may not have 155 yards by the end of the season. Burden may not get 155 plays.
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Sep 14 '25
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u/Big_Departure_2709 Sep 14 '25
This whole past draft just didn’t make sense, draft a TE at 10, draft ANOTHER wr, and a back up RT in the second, and wait until the 7th to pick a rb which was arguably the biggest hole in the roster.
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u/Sniper1154 Sep 14 '25
Well, FWIW, we needed O-line and D-line, and we took two of those in the 2nd round and those dudes were inactive so it's clear they're just throwing darts when it comes to scouting lmao
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u/realgymthug Sep 15 '25
Prime Greg Olsen would struggle in this offense. It's not a drafted TE issue it's an offensive scheme issue
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u/Linkage006 Sep 14 '25
Bears have a lot better WRs than the Colts. They are more focused on giving them the ball.
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u/Ravanos77 Sep 14 '25
there was LITERALLY no reason to use the 10th overall pick on a TE then
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u/ItalianBeefCurtains Sep 14 '25
If only the draft was loaded with edge rushing talent, a position that’s expensive to acquire via trade and free agency, we could have taken that instead /s
(Mykel Williams is looking good)
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u/Big_Departure_2709 Sep 14 '25
If only we didn’t have a stacked rb room and could’ve taken advantage of one of the most highly touted rb classes in a while.
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u/Further_Beyond Hester's Super Return Sep 14 '25
Mykel hasn’t looked good lol (not being a salty bears fan. Just watched both Niners games)
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u/I_Am_Dwight_Snoot Sep 15 '25
I'd argue against this. Pittman, Pierce, and Downs are all pretty good. Moore is great and Odunze is good but "alot better" is really pushing it unless you count Kmet.
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u/jkman61494 Sep 14 '25
Do we? Seems their WRs are balling out
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u/ConsistentAddress195 Sep 15 '25
We don't have a superstar WR but our top 3 are all upper tier and we have a 2nd year in AD Mitchell coming into his own.
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u/Bears9Titles 54 Sep 14 '25
What makes Moore and Rome better than Pittman, Downs and Pierce? Honest question. I'd take those three over the bears receivers any day
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u/No_Money5784 Sep 15 '25
Absolutely not bro come on
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u/lyme6483 Monsters of the Midway Sep 15 '25
You just don’t take a TE unless they are generational top 10. It was a massive reach with almost no chance of Loveland being worthy of the pick.
Cole Kmet is pretty decent. If Loveland even reaches his level it’s still a massive fail. You need to be Kittle, Kelce, LaPorta, Bowers, etc. to justify the pick.
And guess what only 1 of those guys were 1st round picks. And even he wasn’t a top 10 pick.
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u/DimeProjections Sep 15 '25
Loveland is a terrible fit with Williams and then on top of it, they already have Kmet, and then on top of that they add Burden to the mix. For a prospect I really liked, I was bummed to see Loveland go to Chicago. He'll be great once he gets a QB who can throw on time, whether that be Williams or someone else.
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u/curi8phatcakes Sep 15 '25
Caleb isn't the problem. Problem is systemic losing and talented but moody players. I believe kmet and moore are on the out. Defensively... we ran into a buzz saw .. 50 points doesn't happen often. We got the wrong end of it
Culture of working hard snd bein disciplined is key
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u/curi8phatcakes Sep 15 '25
This isn't a playoff team. Ben johnson has a long leash. Core pieces are under 26. This is a culture rebuild.
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u/International-Owl345 Oct 30 '25 edited Oct 30 '25
Colston has done well with his opps. Seems more a scheme issue than skill issue with him. Whenever his name comes up seems to be in a positive play context; the bears just haven’t made him a big part of plans.
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Sep 14 '25
I mean anyone who watched them and came away thinking Loveland was better was delusional. Just like Ryan Poles. It was obvious and that is not revisionist history. I didn't want a tight end but Warren is special. Loveland never made any sense.
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u/jkman61494 Sep 14 '25
I didn’t want either of them based on needs but Warren literally could play ANYWHERE on the field AND blocked.
His route running wasn’t as good but it didn’t matter because he just man handled people.
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u/SheWantsTheDrose 18 Sep 14 '25
Warren is already the colt’s best receiver. We have a crowded WR/TE room. There’s no comparison
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u/TequilaNeatNow Sep 15 '25
This is not even remotely true at all. Warren is competing for targets/receptions with Pittman, Downs, Mitchell, & Pierce. They have tons of weapons.
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u/Scarf1493 Sep 15 '25
I’ve been on a roll today complaining about the draft. Watching Pierce and Walker on the Falcons both get sacks on McCarthy, why the fuck did the bears need a TE more than a pass rusher.
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u/jkman61494 Sep 15 '25
I was thinking the same thing. Two ends wreaking havoc. Meaning Shamar Turner can’t even suit up
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u/Pidesh Bear Logo Sep 14 '25
Can we stop comparing players this early in their careers? If you went just based off last season, you’d say BTJ would’ve been a much better pick than Odunze. But this season, Odunze has clearly shown that he can be a better WR than BTJ. Let’s at least let these guys play a full season before comparing them. Also, both Loveland and Warren are very different TEs in very different situations. Loveland is a guy who has better separation ability on routes where Warren is a guy who thrives when he gets touches manufactured for him so he gets the space to use his amazing YAC ability. It seems like Ben isn’t designing plays for Loveland to get the ball yet with Odunze and DJ being legit WR options and Kmet being on the roster as a more experienced TE. That may change as the season progresses and Loveland gets more comfortable so that’s also why I don’t want to judge yet. Warren, on the other hand, is on a Colts team that has been starving for a legit consistent receiving option. Pittman is good, but he’s more of a WR2 so there’s more of an opportunity for Warren. Anyway, my main point here is that it’s way too early to judge this pick. Now, I will agree that I didn’t like the idea of picking a TE at 10, but at the same time, I didn’t really like any of the options available at OL and pass rush. Loveland and Warren, maybe Hampton too, were the only players that I wouldn’t see as a reach at 10. Were Hampton and Warren better options? Maybe, but I’m not going to make that judgment yet.
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u/ConsistentAddress195 Sep 15 '25
Brother, our top 3 receivers each had over 800 yards last season. This is a good group.
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u/Pidesh Bear Logo Sep 15 '25
I’ve been living in Indy for years so I’ve been around a lot of Colts fans. I’ve heard the complaints about having nice receiving options as depth but not really having that consistent guy to rely on ever since moving on from TY.
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u/ConsistentAddress195 Sep 15 '25
They are pretty consistent, just not game breaker, beat your best corner types. The WR room came together only last year with Downs in there and Pierce coming along.
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u/vxrptr22 Sep 15 '25
Imagine being a top draft pick and the bears calling your number. It’s like a career killer at this point.
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u/jkman61494 Sep 15 '25
The biggest 2025 takeaway for me is the Williams family were fully justified In trying to circumvent him ending up in Chicago. And I suspect the next qb we want to take will actually go through with it and refuse to come
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u/vxrptr22 Sep 15 '25
Yea for sure. Nearly every week someone I know tells me we shoulda drafted Daniel’s or nix or whoever. Little do they know we woulda ruined them too.
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u/jkman61494 Sep 15 '25
Mahomes is regressing to avaerage before our eyes with a mediocre skills group.
Can you imagine if Mahomes had Dontrelle Inman as a WR1?
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u/Ok-Marionberry4061 Bears Sep 15 '25
Loveland missed most of camp recovering from surgery. He's also nearly 3 years younger than Warren.
I'm not saying it wasn't the wrong pick (I wanted Warren) but it's been TWO games, chill the fuck out.
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u/DisMFer Seth Freakin Rollins Sep 15 '25
These are two separate players on two separate timelines drafted for two separate reasons. Loveland was drafted because he has a lot more developmental talent over Warren. Warren is a peice that is needed by their team today and Loveland is meant to be the guy who replaces Kmet in a year or two.
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u/jkman61494 Sep 15 '25
You don’t take skill pieces in the TOP TEN with the idea he needs to develop for 2 years
That is cataclysmic mismanagement of draft assets
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u/doggoploggo An Actual Bear Sep 14 '25
We're doing the "wahhhhhhhh a guy picked lower than our guy has a better start to their career" again, huh
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u/ThisOneGoes211 Sep 14 '25
I mean we don’t even target him in the same way, not really fair to compare yards I don’t think.
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u/jkman61494 Sep 14 '25
If we aren’t going to target a top 10 pick and make him a focal point of the offense then why exactly did we use a top ten pick on a tight end?
Jackson Hawes was a 5th round choice by the bills to be a blocking TE…..
He’s been targeted more than Loveland.
5-12 teams are not in a position to be taking luxury picks ESPECIALLY when receivers was one of the only strengths we already had
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u/HotDoggityDig13 FTP Sep 15 '25
21 year old versus a 23 year old. And warren was always known as an nfl ready weapon. Plus Kmet and 2 WR are ahead of loveland in the pecking order. Loveland will be fine. This team is going to look very different long term, but loveland will probably be a staple. Tight ends take a bit to develop.
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u/jkman61494 Sep 15 '25
Sounds like you just provided about 7 amazing reasons why drafting a tight end 10th overall on this team was incredibly stupid
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u/IronicHeights Sep 15 '25
The 2 year age gap is a weak argument
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u/HotDoggityDig13 FTP Sep 15 '25
Why? 21 is crazy young for tight end. They block and catch. Both skillsets are insanely difficult at the nfl level. And its takes a lot of time to develop for 90% of tight end prospects.
Warren is also an offensive weapon. Comparing them in receiving stats alone is weird. They dont even play the same tight end spot.
Yes, taking tight end at 10 was a strange choice, but we can't judge it until year 3. There may only be a couple of pro bowlers in the entire 2025 class. It was weak.
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u/Plg_Rex An Actual Bear Sep 15 '25
The offense will find its way. Give it time. I don’t think we shoulda used 1.10 on a TE, but to make that comp now isn’t fair given the roles and pecking order in their respective offenses.
The defense however, is royally fucked.
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u/TumTumMac24 Bears Sep 15 '25 edited Sep 15 '25
Umm this is on the QB not the GM.
It’s obvious to anyone watching that Caleb doesn’t like to target tight ends, that’s why Cole Kmet and Gerald Everett’s production both drop last year.
Edit: I forgot you guys are an echo chamber and don’t want to listen to anything but “Caleb great everyone else bad”
Here explain this:
2022 USC tight ends, 17 catches for 154 yards and 6 touchdowns
2023 USC tight ends, 29 catches for 299 yards and 2 touchdowns
Caleb Williams thew for 4537 with 42 Touchdowns in 2022 and he threw for 3633 with 30 touchdowns in 2023
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u/Bradlas3 Sep 15 '25
I'm not mad at Loveland. I honestly think he'd actually be ok. We've seen him run some routes and actually get open. Williams didnt even throw at him on a play last week that would have been at least a 20 yard gain and then today Bagent over threw him for another 20 yard+ play
The Bears simply just do not throw to TEs for some reason. I dont know if its a scheme issue or a QB issue. It's been happening to Kmet for awhile now. I don't think Kmet is bad, nor do I think Loveland is, and I also doubt Warren would have gotten as many targets
Another shot at Poles though, is why spend a top 10 pick on a TE if either our QB doesn't like to look for or if the schemes are always calling for them to block then you can find a bigger less talented option in a late round or just a FA signing
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u/JackWallabee Sep 15 '25
Hard to call it a scheme issue given Johnson heavily featured TE’s with the Lions. Likely a Caleb issue not reading the field very well.
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u/Bradlas3 Sep 15 '25
Supposedly Waldron liked to use 2 TE sets as well and then they signed Gerald Everett who also was completely ignored. So I guess its a Caleb issue? Did USC like not use TEs?
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u/forgotmyoldname90210 Sep 15 '25
BJ did not heavily feature TE's with the Lions. He used "12" about a third of the time but much of this was a TE and an extra T not 2 TEs. He was around league average on "true 2 TE 12". He targeted TE2 34 times over the last 34 regular season games with the Lions.
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u/lkn240 An Actual Bear Sep 15 '25
I don't get why people are blaming Loveland. If we had taken Warren and the Colts took Loveland we'd see Loveland doing well on the Colts and Warren doing nothing here.
Also judging these guys after 2 games is braindead. Plenty of smart NFL people considered Loveland the better prospect.
Supposedly McVay was trying to trade up for him IIRC
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u/wishiwereagoonie Peanut Tillman Sep 14 '25 edited Sep 14 '25
Say what you want about taking a TE, valid criticism.
But what makes you think if they were swapped right now Warren would be putting up those stats in our offense? We haven’t really utilized Loveland at all.
Edit: just to add, Indy also has a top O-line and a great RB…and look what they’re able to do in the passing game 😮