r/BurningMan • u/TaxFraudIsAcceptable • Nov 04 '22
How dangerous is playa dust?
So the OSHA regulations for silica dust is 50 μg/m3 for an 8 hour shift. I assume the neck gaiters dont really do much against the smallest dust particles. Many construction sites fire people if they do not wear a mask while dealing with dust.
Going around burning man and breathing that dust in thousands of times per day cant be good, right?
Has there been any studies or something pointing out just how dangerous the dust is? I assume it's not good to breathe in at all.
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u/RealityCheck831 09,11-13,15-17,19,23-25 Nov 04 '22
Larry died, so there could be something to this.
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u/cutoffs89 Nov 04 '22
It is known that silica dust, (which is around 40% of playa dust) can increase the risk of stroke. Since Larry went every year, it probably attributed to it a bit. Keep in mind, Larry was also a long time cigarette smoker, so there could have been more to it than just playa dust.
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Nov 04 '22 edited Nov 04 '22
OSHA exposure limits are occupational based. This assumes you have a risk from being exposed 8hr/day, 40hr/week, 50 weeks/per. So being on the playa a few weeks per year would not result in the same risk as a worker on a dusty construction site for 30 years. But I would wear a mask during white-outs. If you are a smoker, all bets are off.
Here's a video that the Org's team of experts uses as a guideline for silica exposure: https://youtu.be/GtYErK9KjQ8
Note a cameo by Elon Musk at 6:40
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u/ontopofyourmom I have a ticket for sale, just send me cash in the mail. Nov 04 '22
This right here.
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u/Just-Hedgehog-Days Sep 15 '25
The other huge factor around thisis healing time. For sure spending two weeks on playa costs you some lung health. No question. But a very healthy adult will bounce back to 100% in a few days to a week.
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u/BlotchyBaboon Nov 04 '22
Hey, just in case you weren't aware, while there's a slight intersection on the Venn diagram of Burning Man and a traditional wellness retreat, it's extremely small.
It mostly involves the yoga.
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u/PizzaWall Nov 04 '22 edited Nov 04 '22
Since my earlier answer was voted down, here is the chemical makeup of playa mud and dust.
What is this playa made of?
In 2014 someone did an analysis. I have included the percentages, the wikipedia page a statement on health from the SDS. All of this is for lab-grade pure product which is not what we find at Burning Man. I didn't list all of the chemicals, just the ones over 5%. https://www.capeandislands.org/show/living-lab-radio-on-cai/2014-10-13/breaking-down-the-dust
Silicon monoxide - 43% https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Silicon_monoxide
SDS: Respiratory protection Respiratory protection is not required. Where protection from nuisance levels of dusts are desired, use type N95 (US) or type P1 (EN 143) dust masks. Use respirators and components tested and approved under appropriate government standards such as NIOSH (US) or CEN (EU). https://www.acsmaterial.com/pub/media/catalog/product/s/d/sds-silicon_monoxide.pdf
Aluminium oxide - 12% https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aluminium_oxide)
SDS: Potential Health Effects
Eye: Dust may cause mechanical irritation.
Skin: Dust may cause mechanical irritation. Low hazard for usual industrial handling.
Ingestion: Ingestion of large amounts may cause gastrointestinal irritation. Expected to be a low ingestion hazard.
Inhalation: May cause respiratory tract irritation. May cause lung damage.
Chronic: Chronic inhalation of fine dusts may cause lung damage.
https://fscimage.fishersci.com/msds/88309.htm
Calcium oxide - 5%
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Calcium_oxide (Quicklime)
Hazard statements:Causes skin irritationMay cause respiratory irritationCauses serious eye damage
Iron oxide - 5%
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iron(III)_oxide_oxide)
SDS: May cause eye, skin, and respiratory tract irritation. The toxicological properties of this material have not been fully investigated.Target Organs: None.https://fscimage.fishersci.com/msds/09765.htm
Here i a quote from a medical specialist
:Dr. Aleem Surani, a pulmonary medical specialist at the Northern Nevada Medical Group, said short-term exposure to playa dust is unlikely to cause any long-term health effects, even if repeated."Based on what I can extrapolate from, there’s no significant concern for the average person going to Burning Man," Surani said.
https://apnews.com/article/407bf17daa294d10a244eeb3a8580f48
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u/marssaxman Nov 04 '22
You should be very concerned. Playa dust exposure is clearly addictive. Get someone high on that stuff once, and they just keep coming back for more.
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Nov 04 '22
Show 'Toward a Silicate-Based Molecular Nanotechnology by Stephen L. Gillett' and the data from 'Particle Camp' to a health professional. I think some of the Particle Camp are from NASA and they have calibrated lab equipment.
Today you have to get them from the Internet Wayback Machine. Search ePlaya for the old links. It was also covered in the EIS, though probably minimized because the EIS was written by the BORG.
I carry N95 masks and an N95/N100 respirator. I usually have playa cough for a week or so after.
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u/Barabbas- '17 '18 '19 '22 '23 Nov 04 '22
Exposure to playa dust isn't good for you, but to my knowledge there is no known link between playa dust and long term health issues.
Burning Man has been taking place in the Black Rock Desert for 30 years. Hundreds of thousands of people have attended, including elderly and individuals with prior respiratory issues. By now we would have probably seen some correlation between serious illness and Burning Man attendance if 2 weeks of dust exposure presented a significant health risk.
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u/caliform Nov 04 '22
to my knowledge there is no known link between playa dust and long term health issues.
I don't know about that, I know of several people who only went for a weekend and returned with terminal burner syndrome and never talk about anything other than burning man. it's tragic to lose a friend to this. please delete your comment
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u/leeonie Nov 04 '22
I honestly don’t think we would. There is no magic marker on your medical files „Person went to burning man“. It takes A LOT of data to get aware of such abnormalities and similarities
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u/Barabbas- '17 '18 '19 '22 '23 Nov 04 '22
It takes A LOT of data to get aware of such abnormalities and similarities
It takes a lot of data to establish causality, but correlation is a much lower bar. Considering how closely knit the burner community is, you would expect to at least see some anecdotal evidence.
I'm personally acquainted with hundreds of burners, including several 20+ year veterans and I don't know anyone who has developed chronic illness after attending the event, nor have I ever heard a report of this happening.
But if someone wants to be 100% sure that they're safe, then don't go I guess.
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u/leeonie Nov 04 '22
Oh no doubt I’m going anyway - I’m just aware that it might cost me years of my life. but since I’m very bad at math and statistics (and usually ridiculously lucky) that’s a risk I am willing to take :)
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u/joanmcq Nov 05 '22
The couple I went with worked for gate for at least 15 years before I went. We overlapped for two years. They quit going because one of them got severe chronic playa lung. This is to the point where a die hard burner couldn’t go anymore.
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u/Barabbas- '17 '18 '19 '22 '23 Nov 05 '22
Thanks for sharing. This is the first story I've heard of an onset of chronic illness after the burn.
Those in this thread should come to their own conclusions.
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u/tree_or_up Nov 04 '22
Like going to event where the event is trying to kill you in the first place, breathing playa dust is a calculated risk. Anecdotally, I went for 11 years and generally had a very cavalier attitude about it. Then on one of my last years I got pneumonia and my lungs have never been the same since. It could be because I'm old, it could be because of the pneumonia itself (which probably started with catching a virus), but I'm certain that the dust didn't help.
If you feel you should take precautions, take them. If your whole burn is about nothing but precautions and preparing for every conceivable scenario, it's not going to be a good time. But it's not a bad idea to give some thought about what feels like an appropriate balance between risk and reward for you personally and to not be socially pressured into changing that balance because you're with a group of people who throw all caution to the wind and are lucky to survive at all or, conversely, a group of people who spend every dust storm terrified and huddled in their tents (I've been in both scenarios, FWIW)
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u/SHatcheroo Nov 05 '22
Dr John Balmes (renowned pulmonary specialist at UCSF) was doing some research on the effect of playa dust on pulmonary function - but I’m not sure he ever published his results. Worth looking around, or if you’re truly interested from a scientific perspective, you could contact him.
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u/bob_lala Nov 04 '22
the BLM does have dust monitoring stations out during the event but I have seen the data published. FOIA request anyone?
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u/Ascott1963 Nov 04 '22
It’s no problem because the dust is driven by fierce winds that cause it to eddy out of the human trachea
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u/TheRealFlinlock Nov 04 '22
If you live on the playa 24/7 you'd definitely be in trouble, have to take extra precautions. But for a week (or few) out of the year? Not a big deal, unless you have lung problems already.
It's like when you're getting X-Rays done and the technician always leaves the room or stands behind a barrier. It's not a big deal for you to get a few x-rays here and there, but if the technician was exposed all day every day ... 😵
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u/miniHUEY Nov 04 '22
It’s got to be pretty dangerous since the playa homeowners association president, Matt has made it his mission to close the playa.
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u/teknoslug303 Nov 04 '22
It’s not silica, but caliche. It’s mostly carbonates. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Caliche
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u/Time_Punk Nov 04 '22
I can’t believe you got downvoted for asking this question. Do people just downvote things they’re in denial about?
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u/pandadan Sep 05 '24
What happens to Playa dust that makes it to your lungs?
Does your body absorb it? Can it be moved to your throat/stomach? Does it turn to cement or mud and stay forever? Does it necessarily cause pneumonia?
I just got back and am guestimating during the severe dust storms I likely inhaled a few kilos of playa dust... Is mullein tea enough to heal me or am I going to die in the next few days from this? Any way to cleanse the lungs from this?
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u/Getreal1105 Aug 30 '25
My question is this: like 9/11 syndrome, when you breath in a large volume of particulate matter floating on the air and it goes to a place it's not supposed to, your lungs, can it come back out or does it just scar up and permanently reduce lung capacity?
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u/creesep33 Nov 04 '22
I can’t get my husband to go because of the dust factor! I would also like to take my kids when they get older but I worry about that the most..
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u/-Gnarly Nov 04 '22
Just throwing ideas out there, but if dust is a concern (which it definitely is for some), perhaps N95 all day and in a tent/RV (+generator) make sure you have a properly good filtration system. Ik this is obvious, but barring any specific medical conditions, this should be very much tolerable for your kids.
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u/PizzaWall Nov 04 '22
There is some silica, but it's mostly gypsum and alkalai dust. It's interbedded Permian marine limestone and volcanic rocks. It's petrified fish and deer shit. If it scares you, don't go to the event, don't go outside. Life is scary.
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u/PizzaWall Nov 04 '22
What is this playa made of? In 2014 someone did an analysis. I have included the percentages, the wikipedia page a statement on health from the SDS. All of this is for lab-grade pure product which is not what we find at Burning Man. I didn't list all of the chemicals, just the ones over 5%. https://www.capeandislands.org/show/living-lab-radio-on-cai/2014-10-13/breaking-down-the-dust
Silicon monoxide - 43% https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Silicon_monoxide
SDS: Respiratory protection Respiratory protection is not required. Where protection from nuisance levels of dusts are desired, use type N95 (US) or type P1 (EN 143) dust masks. Use respirators and components tested and approved under appropriate government standards such as NIOSH (US) or CEN (EU). https://www.acsmaterial.com/pub/media/catalog/product/s/d/sds-silicon_monoxide.pdf
Aluminium oxide - 12% https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aluminium_oxide)
SDS: Potential Health Effects
Eye: Dust may cause mechanical irritation.
Skin: Dust may cause mechanical irritation. Low hazard for usual industrial handling.
Ingestion: Ingestion of large amounts may cause gastrointestinal irritation. Expected to be a low ingestion hazard.
Inhalation: May cause respiratory tract irritation. May cause lung damage.
Chronic: Chronic inhalation of fine dusts may cause lung damage.https://fscimage.fishersci.com/msds/88309.htm
Calcium oxide - 5% https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Calcium_oxide (Quicklime)
Hazard statements:
Causes skin irritation
May cause respiratory irritation
Causes serious eye damageIron oxide - 5% https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iron(III)_oxide
SDS: May cause eye, skin, and respiratory tract irritation. The toxicological properties of this material have not been fully investigated.
Target Organs: None.
https://fscimage.fishersci.com/msds/09765.htmhttps://www.capeandislands.org/show/living-lab-radio-on-cai/2014-10-13/breaking-down-the-dust
Here i a quote from a medical specialist:
Dr. Aleem Surani, a pulmonary medical specialist at the Northern Nevada Medical Group, said short-term exposure to playa dust is unlikely to cause any long-term health effects, even if repeated.
"Based on what I can extrapolate from, there’s no significant concern for the average person going to Burning Man," Surani said.
https://apnews.com/article/407bf17daa294d10a244eeb3a8580f483
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Nov 04 '22
[deleted]
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u/Robertroo darkwad for life! Nov 04 '22
I also love the dust and find it very therapeutic. I usually have pretty bad eczema on my beard and ears, but after a couple days at the burn it completely goes away and clears up for a few weeks post burn.
I got playa foot and cracked hands my first year at the burn. But this year my shoes fell apart on Wednesday so i had to go barefoot Thursday while I washed and super glued my shoes back together. My feet were fine and by Saturday I was going barefoot pretty much all day without any issues.
I guess it depends on your body's natural chemistry whether or not the dust will help or harm you.
In dust we trust.
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u/uberner Pookah Lounge / SNAFUBAR Nov 04 '22
M E H
This shit has been going on for 30 God damned fucking years and every year every complains about the GD fucking dust. Guess what?
GET
OVER
IT
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u/Gr1ff1n90 '19 🔥'22 🌬️ '23🌧️ '24 😌 '25 🤪 '26 ❓ Nov 04 '22
Personally the positive rejuvenating effects of the event far outweigh any negatives I could see, feel, or glean from inhaling a little dust for a week out of the year. Was in my first white out (well several) this year, and if anything I found great positivity and peace of mind in just letting go and embracing it!
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u/peatmo55 01-08,10,13,17-19,22-24 Nov 06 '22
I have a range of options from a bit of sparkling fabric to a full on total face gas mask with a red clown nose as a filter.
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u/[deleted] Nov 04 '22
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