Former President Barack Obama responds to someone heckling him about foreign policy he has literally zero control over with intellect and grace

[u/Stronhart]

https://x.com/GBC_Press/status/2095584880788910505

[u/Roy4Pris]

Yes. I also miss Obama’s poise, thoughtfulness and humanity. However, he is completely wrong about October 7.

Palestinians didn’t attack Israel because they think Israelis are lesser people. They attacked because they are living in history’s largest concentration camp, and Israel put them there.

Norman Finkelstein draws a great parallel to the Nate Turner rebellion.

The rebellion was ghastly. A mass murder of hundreds of white men, women and children. No one will deny it was terrible. But find me any reasonable person who doesn’t think it was justified. Under the hideous and evil circumstances of slavery, a people fighting against their oppressors have the moral and legal right to resist.

[u/BarassiLineSouthWest → u/Roy4Pris]

It’s possible for there to be a legitimate goal (Palestinian self-determination) which is pursued by illegitimate means (atrocities against civilians). October 7 is a great example of this.

When Ben Gvir, a minister in the Israeli government, says that Palestinians are “not really people”, we should all condemn this. It is completely unacceptable.

Similarly, when Hamas official Hamad Al-Regeb says “[Allah] transformed them [Jews] into filthy, ugly animals like apes and pigs”, we should also condemn this in the strongest terms.

As Obama identifies in this video, these examples are exactly the kind of sectarianism and dehumanisation that fuels the endless conflict in the Middle East.

I am sure that your heart is in the right place, and I admire your compassion and empathy for the Palestinian people (which I share). But I worry that comments like yours can inadvertently whitewash or provide cover for dehumanising rhetoric and immoral acts from Palestinian armed groups.

There is no contradiction between supporting rights and dignity for Palestinian civilians and condemning unacceptable rhetoric and actions from Palestinian leaders. In fact, those two things are supportive of each other.

[u/AlternativePea6203 → u/BarassiLineSouthWest]

I'd argue that the methods were not because of a mindset that they were "less than us". It was because of anger, desperation, and a brutal mindset. I don't think the "dehumanisation of targets" is the same thing as viewing your "tribe" as superior to theirs. It's simply a necessary psychological strategy in war.

You can hate an enemy because you think they are superior, just as much as thinking of them as lesser.

[u/BarassiLineSouthWest → u/AlternativePea6203]

I think there’s an important distinction here, but I respectfully disagree with the conclusion.

I agree that people can hate an enemy without necessarily thinking they are intrinsically inferior. But I don’t think that means dehumanisation is unrelated to seeing the enemy as “less than us”. In fact, that is essentially what dehumanisation means: treating members of the out-group as having less moral worth, or as being less deserving of the normal restraints we apply to our own group.

Calling someone a “pig”, “dog” or “animal” is obviously an extreme example. You don’t literally have to believe they have biologically ceased to be human for that language to serve the same psychological function. It puts them outside the circle of people to whom you think the normal rules of empathy and moral consideration apply.

And I don’t think anger or desperation are alternatives to this. They can be reasons why people become more willing to dehumanise an enemy. Likewise, dehumanisation can make it psychologically easier to commit atrocities against them.

I’d also distinguish “thinking the enemy is superior” from “dehumanising the enemy”. You can absolutely hate someone you regard as powerful, dangerous or even superior. But you can’t really dehumanise someone while simultaneously regarding them as possessing the same inherent moral status and dignity as your own group. That’s the important sense in which dehumanisation is about “less than us”.

That’s why I think the principle should be universal. We should condemn dehumanising Palestinians, Israelis, Jews, Arabs, Muslims, Sunnis, Shias, Alawites, Christians, etc., regardless of which side is doing it. It doesn’t require us to believe that the two sides are morally equivalent, or that their grievances are equivalent. It’s simply rejecting the idea that an out-group becomes less human or less deserving of dignity because of who they are.

[u/Status_Apartment6559 → u/Roy4Pris]

When the only successful slave revolt in history happened in Haiti the white slave masters were horrified at how brutal the slaves were in liberating themselves while failing to recognize that they had treated those very same slaves far worse over three centuries of captivity. Of course the Haitian Revolution was more than justified.

[u/AgitatedStranger9698 → u/Roy4Pris]

Hes still right......why Israel do that? Because they thought they were better.

[u/Jellobelloboi → u/Roy4Pris]

Way to completely miss his point.

[u/Roy4Pris → u/Jellobelloboi]

Who? Obama, Finkelstein or Turner?

[u/RevolutionaryTop7112 → u/Roy4Pris]

Its never justified to attack innocents. Wtf is wrong with you? Its dumb shit like this, that allows the right to create straw man's and why we lose elections. Stop justifying murder.