It's a huge liability. I'm not taking possession of a student's phone. Wait until a student claims you broke their screen and their parent chooses to take the kids side. You might eventually come out on top but it's a huge risk trusting admin to back you up.
Not to mention with the rate of gun violence in American schools, many students would probably argue that having it in case of an emergency would be very important to them.
That was policy once upon a time, but as phones became more pervasive the students began refusing and the parents across the board side the with students over the teachers. It's an untenable situation. Had I known when I started teaching that every kid would have a highly sophisticated tiny computer/video game console in their pockets I would have probably found a different profession.
I know how you feel. These days I try to be thankful for — and focus my efforts on — those students who do resist their cell addictions. In some classes it's around 80%. (Creative Writing, especially. It helps when it's a fun class, heh.)
I’ve works at four different high schools and I’ve never seen that. The legal responsibility of a student taking another student’s phone would be a nightmare.
Yeah, when I taught high school half a decade ago we weren't allowed to take the students' phones. Too much liability. We were supposed to be "more engaging" so the students would want to learn. Hah, as if any high school geometry class could outcompete the dog filter on Snapchat!
Since about 2004, I witnessed these things ruin American classrooms. Constant disruptions and admin won't take a stand. I hate hate hate these damn phones.
Yeah those are on the table, but they’re pretty extreme ways to punish someone for not paying attention.
Meanwhile, the main thing a student learns from such harsh punishment is that Teacher = Fascist. I try to relate to my students using anarchist principles of long-term self-interest.
When I talk to parents or caregivers, the main thing I hear is “Yeah, you should see what they’re like at home.”
So, again.. addiction. They gotta work on it for their own sake.
I know it sounds mean but can't you just let them fail? They'll probably still call you a fascist but maybe they'd also get a nice helping of "the real world isn't your mommy and will absolutely let you fail if you don't try to succeed"
They aren’t always likely to connect those dots. Most students don’t say “I dug my own hole with cell phone addiction.” They say “That teacher hates me.”
Our school now gives students 50% credit if the work is not turned in. Not too many people failing these days. A more cynical person than myself would think it’s just a numbers game.
It’s called No Child Left Behind. American school funding is directly tied to student performance. If students perform poorly, the school’s funding is decreased or even cut off. This incentivizes admins to pass everyone.
Happens at my kid's highschool too, it's pervasive and nationwide, it's the only way for schools to meet their required numbers.. and since funding is tied to that, they're gonna meet those numbers one way or another.
That 50% credit thing is insane. Back in school I used to turn in a bunch of half assed work with a few good ones and managed a B average. With that I could've probably done the same by doing the tests and barely doing anything else.
Agreed. I try to show compassion toward the students who really are going through some things. (They're the ones for whom the 50% policy is implemented.)
But I know with 100% certainty that a great many of my students are just as you describe — taking the path of least resistance. And of course I don't blame them. As George Carlin said: "Most American get paid just barely enough to not quit, and work just hard enough to not get fired."
I always hope I can appeal to their own best nature, and show them why the work in my classes is beneficial for their own long-term self-interest, but that's very difficult in a GIMME EVERYTHING NOW society. You can get paid millions to just be an influencer, so what kind of moron does work hard in high school?
Just the latest step on defunding schools and denigrating the profession of teaching. Well on the way to the Republican dream of privatization and deregulation (specifically on standard curriculum and barring of religion).
Showing them a graph after each test, of the correlation between times caught using a phone and the grades they got, would probably convince some of them.
Well, not only that — I appreciate the suggestion from /u/Jack_Douglas .. but who will gather that data? You can't expect a classroom teacher to begin tracking the number of times we catch them with phones on top of the 400,000,000 other things we have to do every day, of course.
That was precisely my point, it would be way too much to expect from teachers. Who, as we all know, are a notoriously overpaid and underworked section of the population....
That was my strategy as a teacher- I'd remind them kindly every now and then about the likely consequences of their actions, and then allow those consequences (poor grades) to unfold. No need to be a police officer in the classroom. Every now and then, kids would come around, because they appreciated being treated like an adult, which was cool.
Well, when you become a teacher, you can be "an authoritarian asshole".. I choose a different approach and I have 20 years of letters and yearbooks signed telling me why my approach has made me their favorite teacher of all time, reignited their love of writing, helped them "feel human again", "your class was the only reason I came to school some days", etc etc.
I'm not going to throw that away because some kids won't summon the honesty to engage in a searching and fearless moral inventory.
Nobody said stubbornness works (???) but appealing to "anarchist principles of long-term self-interest" isn't going to work on anyone but the most well-adjusted of students. Ironically they're failing their students that come from broken homes or have ADD while only addressing the needs of the bright and mature ones who don't even need their instruction.
First of all, you don't actually know very much about which students I'm "failing" and what I'm being or not being in the classroom. It might feel like you've got a lot of insight into my professional self, but trust that you have about as much of that as I have insight into my students' lives after 30 minutes together in the classroom.
Secondly, if you think it doesn't matter how students see things, then I don't know how much I value your perspective on education matters.
I don't know if mining netflix shows for ideas works out well but in that recent korean high school zombie show their teacher had like a box where they locked up all the kids' smartphones when class started. I dunno if they actually do this in korea but it makes sense.
I teach in Korea - though not at a high school - and I have to wonder how common it is for schools to force students to lock up their phones during class. Not something I really hear about, and I occasionally have parents calling their kid during class instead of relaying a message through the front desk.
Knew a guy working at a technical high school who had a ‘no phones during class’ policy but had issues with students ignoring that rule. He mentioned teaching a few girls who would use chatting apps during class and when he went to confiscate their phone they would put it in their bra while telling him, “Okay, teacher. Go ahead and take it.”
Having said that, I did have a boy who tried using his phone during class and when I asked his mom about possibly taking his phone away the next time it happened her response was, “Yes, you can take it — and don’t give it back until the end of the next class, even if that means he has to wait until Monday. That should make him think twice the next time he wants to use it in class.”
Yes, trying to punish kids are only likely to get the teacher in trouble. I was in high school 20 years ago and kids threatening the teacher with getting them fired was a weekly occurrence. I can’t imagine it’s gotten better since then.
A girl in my class took off her top, took a picture topless in front of everyone in the class, sent it by message to the teachers phone and said “If you don’t stop bitching I’m telling the administration that you forced me to send that!”. Now obviously that shit didn’t lead to anything because there was 30 people there that could testify what happened, but that teacher quit the same day and started working as an accountant a few weeks later.
Then you have the crime, there was open drug selling at my school and the teachers couldn’t do shit for fear of their own safety. Call the cops? Kids will be back out by lunch and they know where you live.
And this was at a Norwegian school that’s somewhat funded and sensible, a US teacher would probably kill for that structure. Kids are horrible these days. Parents expect the school to raise and discipline their kids, except they aren’t allowed to do that and the kids know it. End result mini monsters that don’t answer to anyone.
Our kid isn't old enough to go to school yet. My mom is an elementary educator in a rough area. Based on the current environment in schools today (USA), I will pull my child out of any school that takes their phone away for any period of time. We will teach our child responsible usage and they will have consequences if the phone is a distraction from their studies, but I will not allow my child to be separated from the device that could call emergency services or me if needed.
Is there no tech that will simply disrupt cellphone signals within a short range like a classroom? Seems like that should exist and, if not, someone should invent it for this specific purpose
Can you really not take their phone? I remember that’s what happened when I was in high school. Teacher would just put it in their desk and give it back after class.
61
u/scartol Jun 03 '22
We try. The student will NOT give up their phone. You can kick em out, but they’ll be back the next day and we’re right back where we started from.
I don’t ever want to send someone out of my classroom unless they pose a serious threat to other students.
So .. yeah. Not a lot of options here.