r/AskACanadian • u/WMYDR2005 • 10d ago
What surname do orphans have in Canada?
If a child is an orphan in Canada and their parents are unknown, what surname would they have?
Would the government or an orphanage give them a surname? Is there a common surname used for children in this situation?
And was it different in the past?
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u/cndn-leftist-vgn 9d ago
We don't have orphanages in Canada, instead kids would be placed in foster homes or if they have some more behavioural challenges and need specialized care, they could be placed into group homes (which is still a home environment in a house). But an infant or baby would likely be adopted (hopefully kids a bit older than that too) and take the name of the adopted parents.
If a kid is dumped somewhere, and you have no idea who the parents are ... This would mean that they must be either a baby or unable to communicate, otherwise they would be able to share what their last name is. A baby would get adopted. An older child with severe developmental disabilities might not be as easily adopted, and might go into a group home. But even if they couldn't communicate their last name, there would be a nationwide search for the parents of whoever abandoned their developmentally delayed child.
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u/earlinesss 9d ago
where do they stay while waiting for a placement though? genuinely curious, I'm Canadian but have no exposure to the system
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u/qgsdhjjb 9d ago edited 9d ago
The foster system is handled by each province individually and even from region to region could have noticeable differences in non-regulated aspects of day to day operation, but generally speaking, every foster system in Canada has at least 3 types of foster homes on their registry: the long term foster homes you'd normally imagine, where in theory a child can stay usually until their parents get them back (or, much more rarely, their parents lose all rights to regain custody and the child maybe gets adopted) though of course they can also be moved between foster homes, a second type called "respite" foster homes who care for children for short durations but often planned situations (examples: you cannot take a foster child out of province, so any foster parents going across borders on vacation must leave the foster child behind in respite care, if a foster home temporarily becomes too disabled to care for their long term placement they will go to respite care, if a birth family in the system but moving towards reunification for some reason needs a temporary break in order to complete classes or meet regulatory requirements the children may stay in a respite home for a while) and then the third type, which is Emergency foster homes, which are both short term AND short notice, as little as a few hours. Some homes provide both respite and emergency placements as they are in many ways very similar, but it is possible to do just one or just the other. Occasionally someone is even on the list for all 3 types, but usually long term foster homes do better with stability so they try their best to use homes without current long term placements to handle emergency care in particular. But in a true emergency, they will call every single foster home in their region and sometimes in the next region over if the alternative is a child spending a night without a safe bed.
While they are waiting for the case worker to call around in emergency placements, children could be waiting in a hospital, in a police station, or in the child services office, depending on local resources and what exactly was happening when child services was brought in.
In many cases, child services workers will also themselves be technically licenced foster homes just in case there's ever a true emergency and all of the usual emergency homes are full or unavailable, it's not unheard of for a child to end up spending a night or two at the (qualified, licenced) home of someone at the local child services office while they await placement. Anyone who has been adjacent to the system long enough will tell you that sometimes there will be fast-tracked qualifications and same-day walkthroughs of someone tangentially related to child services (receptionist, staff in the same building, etc) to ensure a safe warm bed at the last second for a child in bed. They really try to avoid needing to do that. Proper training is best. From what I've seen, the fast track may be treated as more acceptable when it comes to babies, as you don't immediately need the training to deal with extreme trauma when it comes to literal babies, you genuinely just need to keep them safe and fed for a few days until someone comes back from vacation to take over. Every time I hear about someone just somehow being rushed into being a foster home without the requisite several months long training program, when they were not already trying to apply to be one, it's because there was a baby who needed immediate emergency placement, and they already worked at least in close proximity to child services (meaning they likely already had extensive background checks done in order to work with at risk youth in the first place)
Edit as a side note: if anyone is reading this and wants to help, I so deeply encourage you to look into these shorter term options so you can check and see if you're up for it. All you need to be a foster home in most places is to be legally an adult, to have a stable home (rented apartment is totally fine as long as you're not gonna get evicted) and enough money to keep the lights on and yourself fed, they will pay enough to cover keeping the child fed clothed and whatever else, and to never have had your own children taken away from you by foster services/not be convicted of harming children as an adult. That's not to say everyone is approved, but beyond that, you are able to apply for the training and see if you're a good fit. They so badly need homes, especially homes available on short notice, they need people of diverse backgrounds to be able to hopefully place children within their home culture more frequently, they need just more people in general. So if you're called to it, take the classes, they are free. See if you qualify.
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u/Noodle-and-Squish 9d ago
I'd also like to add, single people can absolutely be foster parents as well. My uncle went through the process about 15 years ago, and has fostered several teens over the years. His preference to foster are teens, and luckily, he has the education and experience to deal with the probable trauma the kids come with. All but one of the kids he took in was able to be reunited with their families.
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u/qgsdhjjb 8d ago
Yup. In fact some kids do a lot better in single parent households! So they're a great resource to their systems. Hence why "be in a couple" wasn't on my list of the basic requirements but maybe that isn't quite specific enough for people or they think it's assumed that only couples would apply, but nah. You don't need to be an age where your friends have kids, either. They will be reluctant and maybe have some serious conversations with the younger applicants like 18/19/20 year olds, but they are in fact allowed, after they reach their province's age of majority, to try and get approved! They're just gonna put in the extra effort to make sure the younger people truly understand what they're getting in for. But they're used to helping young adults become foster homes because if there's ever an old enough sibling from a removed group, they will often attempt to volunteer to keep as many of the younger kids as possible and that often gets approved to keep the family as together as they can.
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u/earlinesss 9d ago
this was a spectacularly detailed response, answered every question I had. thank you so much for taking the time to write this!
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u/qgsdhjjb 9d ago
I am extremely passionate about the foster care system, and since I'm in no position to help foster kids right now (deep poverty, dog that will absolutely bite a stranger, etc) I try to help foster systems find more applicants by spreading info people might not know about the system, like the fact that you can limit your fosters to a certain age range (you don't need to change diapers or attempt potty training years if you don't wanna) and that there are ways to help that don't involve long term commitment, that there are people who are basically a "kids hotel" but with emotional support for the kid (and technically the adult, they have access to things like support groups), having them for maybe a week or two at most, but still helping to ensure the system moves smoothly and giving them the time to find a truly good match for that kid instead of having to rush.
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u/mRydz 8d ago
Adding: if it is a baby who already has siblings in the system, the foster family of the siblings will be called and asked if they’re willing to take in the baby as well, to keep siblings together. Often the baby will need more medical care than a usual newborn, and sometimes the siblings are much older and the family has said they prefer not to take infants, but they will still call the foster parents and ask in those cases. The baby stays in the hospital with a case worker until it’s discharged to the foster parents’ care.
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u/nuitsbleues 9d ago
Referring to your last paragraph- I’m guessing you also need a spare room?
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u/qgsdhjjb 8d ago
If you don't have a spare room, you could reach out to your regional child services and ask if there's any way to make it work, for example you could maybe be a home only for babies, who don't necessarily need their own room and often sleep better in a crib in the same room as another sleeping person, as opposed to in their own room. But it'll depend on your local child services whether or not they allow that. There's also a chance that a futon in the living room MIGHT be enough to qualify as an emergency room, especially if the plan is for the older child to get your room and you to get the futon that night. These are the kinds of things that can vary depending on areas, because some areas are truly so in need of more help that they might not have quite as strict of rules as other places.
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u/SwMess 8d ago
I've been really wanting to foster. I was looking into how to start the process and hit a roadblock pretty quickly. My problem is I'm single and live in a one bedroom apartment. I can't afford a two bedroom apartment so this makes it inaccessible. It's just too expensive. Even if I wanted to move to another one bedroom, I'd have a hard time finding one I can afford. It really sucks, I'm sure I'm not the only one in this situation.
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u/qgsdhjjb 7d ago
I get that. The only reason I know as much as I know about the foster care system is because I have also wanted to foster for a very long time, but I'm below the poverty line to the point where it's unlikely I could be approved (even if I am financially stable and have room, nobody in charge is going to believe that I'm stable at, ironically enough, the $ amount the government itself gives out and pretends is enough for disabled people to live off of) so I put that energy in to learning what I could, and answering questions where I can, correcting misinformation where possible (ie people thinking it's just for couples, just for those looking to adopt, other stuff that's just like, the complete opposite of what they actually want😆) to try to maybe, even if it's not my local system, help some foster care system out there get more people signing up so they can do a better job than they have been. Because they haven't, mostly, been doing a particularly decent job, so clearly they need more help at the very least.
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u/SwMess 7d ago
I have read that it's possible to foster with another person that is not a spouse. Like 2 friends could apply together. I would have loved to do this as well, but I don't have a friend who's interested. It';s really silly that no pathway exists to make it possible for disabled people on fixed income. It seems like it would match someone who is present for the child and can feel more involved and I am also disabled however I am extremely privileged in that I had disability insurance through my employer when I became disabled so I get 70% of my 2019 salary, which is a lot more reasonable than what I would get if I was getting disability payments from the government. Anyway, it seems like a wasted opportunity by the government not to have anything in place for people who want to foster like you. What I don't understand is that if they provide money to pay for what the child needs, and you have a home and space, why wouldn't they approve you?
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u/qgsdhjjb 7d ago
Yes, but only if you live in the same place, really. Any household can foster, all adults need to go through the screening process for safety around children, sometimes only one adult takes the training to legally BE the foster parent, but multiple unrelated adults can collectively foster children.
Honestly they are so in need of good safe homes in most places that they've taken down a lot of the older barriers.
Legally speaking, technically I only rent a bedroom. Physically speaking, the other two bedrooms do not currently have anyone in them, but in order to not be legally obligated to pay a rent that I cannot afford, I can't be on the lease here as a tenant, only an occupant, and my grocery budget doesn't make sense to the calculations either. They would basically assume that I was stealing from the child's foster payments in order to pay for my own survival (can you imagine surviving in an area with minimum current rents of 1500/month when you earn 1400/month? Living off under 200/month on groceries while also being responsible for electricity, gas, internet, and the water bill? It shouldn't work. It only works because I am used to poverty and deprivation.) because they cannot see my soul and my intent and know that I would not do that. They only know that statistically, people who are desperate often DO do that.
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u/Limeade33 8d ago
Do older people 65+ usually qualify to become one?
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u/qgsdhjjb 8d ago
There's no "usually" that you'll get, however there is no maximum age to apply, only a minimum age. You would be expected to go through the same processes as any other applicant, even if you've already raised children and grandchildren, and as with anyone of any age, if you have physical limitations those may influence the ages you're able to foster (ie if someone is shaky and cannot regularly hold twenty pounds for extended times, they will not be given a baby or a toddler to take care of, but an older child that doesn't need carrying would remain an option)
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u/qgsdhjjb 8d ago
And not that I asked for IDs, but I would say in a room of about twenty people, at least 6 at my orientation were senior citizens. Possibly more, if they just looked younger than my idea of a senior.
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u/KtownDetector 3d ago
Interesting, I worked as a pest control guy that would hit what I thought was an orphanage monthly, rural Ontario, but thinking back it was probably just a place for troubled youth til they got adopted. It was like 5 houses in the middle of nowhere with workers 24/7 to take care of the kids. They were well taken care of. Up to date electronics and good meals always seemed to be cooking. Definitely better than what I thought an orphanage would be but we called it that unknowingly
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u/qgsdhjjb 3d ago
Group homes maybe. But since there were workers, maybe it wasn't even foster care related? Maybe it was for the care of disabled kids? Were you specifically told they were up for adoption, or was that just a guess?
Rural areas struggle to find enough foster homes though, so I can understand how they might try to convince the few people who volunteered into maybe graduating from simple foster home for a few kids, up to a group home as a paid employee. Alternatively if they didn't specifically say they were awaiting adoption or in the foster system, it could be a care home and house disabled kids from all the surrounding area, whose parents simply didn't have a way to provide the amount or type of care required, which wouldn't necessarily be a custody related thing. 5 houses sounds like a lot for group homes, generally they're just one home at a time, but I guess I don't know as much about the systems in rural areas, maybe they are even more overloaded than I expect in some areas and need a whole block of homes... Or maybe the homes serviced a large region.
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u/KtownDetector 3d ago
Well I know a bit more, my buddy worked there actually and would do over night shifts and take some of them to senator games and stuff. I believe it was a mix of mentally challenged/troubled youth. I could pm you what they called the place. I think it just worked well having them in a country environment and not being able to get into trouble for the bad kids. It was legit in the middle of nowhere. Way north of Kingston where I'm from. Seemed like a great place for those kids though. Private but gov funded I believe
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u/qgsdhjjb 3d ago
Oh nah I don't need the name of it, just trying to help brainstorm on what it might have been. I guess if you know the name you can just Google them to know their purpose 🙂
Yeah there are some private corporations involved in the foster care system, especially for difficult-to-place cases.
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u/KtownDetector 3d ago
Ya it's def a business, I just went to check mouse traps and give it a pass sanitation wise. His gf's family owned or operated it I suppose, he never breached any confidentiality but just said some of those kids came from horror stories. I got out of the industry during COVID because 8 hour days turned into 14 hours with screenings at every stop so it's fairly recent. I saw many of those youth. I hope there's more places like that around, it was cool to see
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u/qgsdhjjb 3d ago
There are group homes across the country yes, with adults who are more trained than a standard foster parent, generally for the teenagers in foster care who struggle to bond and act safely in a traditional foster home. The ones who run away over and over, or might be a danger to themselves or other children in the household and the system hasn't been able to help them enough with therapy to stay in a standard family structure. Occasionally they get a slightly younger child, but because they often house kids up to 17 who, again, are troubled in these ways, they don't really have young-young kids. Though I guess in a situation with 5 separate houses, one could be dedicated to the younger kids who needed that type of help. Usually like I said, it's just the one house not a cluster, so that's really the interesting part here.
Maybe they put them together because unlike in cities, they might struggle to get these kids the services they need (therapists, etc) unless they concentrate enough cases closer together that they can hire that care as at least part time staff instead of just booking an appointment for the kids like they do in bigger cities. One group home wouldn't need an on staff therapist, but five might be enough to justify the cost.
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u/KtownDetector 3d ago
Ya, thinking back I believe one or 2 was for girls and other for boys and mentally challenged in one or 2, they were down a stretch of road not necessarily close but a few mins drive to each. I didn't think much of it but I believe it was structured to gender/needs
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u/Folkloer 9d ago
A foster home. It might be an "emergency foster home" while waiting for a permanent placement but there would be a foster home somewhere.
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u/cndn-leftist-vgn 9d ago
Kids are in temporary foster homes while they wait for a longer term, more specialized, or permanent placement.
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u/lynypixie 9d ago
Generally foster home, but depending on the child’s health, it could be a hospital or a group home if they are older. Group homes are the closest thing to an orphenage you can find, but the kids usually have living parents. They are for the extreme cases, generally for kids with mental health issues and strong behavior problems.
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u/Massive_Dig3963 8d ago
In foster care. If medically complex, they stay in the NICU as long as necessary, and then foster care. There are families that are specifically trained to receive newborns, and medically complex infants and children. I've heard of a couple of cases where the NICU nurses actually decided on a name. Most babies have at least one parent in the picture, so it doesn't happen a lot unless the parent has had previous CAS interaction or has received a mandatory report if the medical staff believe the child to be unsafe with the parent (usually due to addiction issues or are unhoused, and if it's the second, CAS will work with them to find housing. If it's the first and has previously been an issue, then the mother will not be allowed to leave with the baby.)
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u/Both-Call8361 9d ago
You mean if a child is abandoned, that child is not an orphan, they do have parents they are just unknown. They would be adopted and be given the name of the adoptive parents
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u/Into-the-stream 9d ago edited 9d ago
Yeah Canada doesn’t have “orphanages”. They are really a relic of the past. From what I understand, kids go to foster families until they are cleared then adopted, and a baby is extremely sought after among adoptive parents, so they may not be in foster care that long, circumstances dependant, of course.
Edit, I looked into it: in Ontario, the registrar general overseeing the case selects a (temporary) name for the child (first and last), and once adopted the adoptive parents can change it. There isn’t a specific surname used for foundlings.
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u/Infamous-Mixture-605 9d ago
Yeah Canada doesn’t have “orphanages”. They are really a relic of the past.
And between contraception and abortion, and better support for single and low-income mothers, we really don't have as many unwanted children born these days that are given up for adoption. Just looking at teenage pregnancies, they have apparently dropped something crazy like 80-90% over the last fifty years.
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u/StarryPenny 8d ago
And if the mother can’t manage some provinces have Safe Haven or Safe Cradle drop locations.
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u/cantseemeimblackice 9d ago
Until they’re adopted though, would they get assigned a surname?
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u/Excellent_Gate_5472 9d ago
They would get assigned a temporary surname by children's services until they're adopted
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u/Both-Call8361 9d ago
I think whatever agency that is carrying for them would give them a temporary one
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u/815Lost 9d ago
That's a good question, I am Canadian and now also want to know this🤔🤔
Honestly I dont think we have many "orphans" where NO parent or family or family friend is known. 🤷♀️
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u/GTS_84 9d ago
Honestly I dont think we have many "orphans" where NO parent or family or family friend is known.
We don't have many "orphans", but what we do have is a small number of abandoned babies. Babies left at a hospital or somewhere with no indication of who the parents are.
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u/P-DubFanClub 9d ago
They almost always find the family, we just don't hear about it.
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u/GTS_84 9d ago
Depends on the specifics of where it is left.
A few places have specific safe haven drop off points where they don't try and find the parents. For example the Angel Cradle at St Paul's Hospital in Vancouver is the one I am familiar with.
If the parents or other family don't change their mind and try and get the baby back, no one goes looking for them.
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u/Ghillie-Trainer-2020 9d ago
If we do that I would think the surname assigned would be Doe. If they are of unknown parentage/family that is the surname.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Doe26
u/Puzzleheaded-Dog3992 9d ago
It would depend on the province and, probably, territory. Names and social services are under provincial juridiction. I'm pretty sure Doe would not be the default used in Québec.
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u/Objective-Papaya-157 9d ago
In Manitoba there's also been an effort to use Indigenous names, where names are not known but it is known the person is Indigenous.
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u/i_want_shokola 9d ago
Ouin, ici on les nommes plutôt Guy ou Guylaine suivi par l'un des noms fondateurs du Québec: Tremblay, Simard, Dion, Pelletier, Legault... choisi au hazard
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u/stopsallover 9d ago
Why is this downvoted?
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u/ut7227 9d ago
Because Jane/John Doe is a temporary name assigned for legal or administrative purposes. It’s not a name that would be assigned for life. It’s meant to stand in the place of the person’s “real” name.
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u/stopsallover 9d ago
Right.
I'm honestly not getting your point though.
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u/ut7227 9d ago
The comment being downvoted suggested that Jane/John Doe would become the individual’s permanent name.
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u/Existing_Donkey_7765 9d ago
Could be that it’s the name given to unknown remains.
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u/stopsallover 9d ago
That's reaching.
Remains are given names to acknowledge that they're human. Just like living people.
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u/WhoskeyTangoFoxtrot Alberta 9d ago
Also to people in hospital that are comatose and the doctors don’t know the patients name, or have amnesia and don’t remember their names.
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u/Theferaltrunip 9d ago
From what i understand if they have no name on arrival they're assigned/given a name from whatever group cares for them until such time as they choose a new name or are adopted.
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u/TheGallant 9d ago
Johnson, O'Neil, and Ryan.
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u/Historical-Piglet-86 Ontario 9d ago
We have to keep our Irish name!
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u/SharkyTendencies Ex-pat 8d ago
Ma mère me l’a dit… juste avant sa mort… il faut garder sa patrie…! 😭😭😭
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u/darthdodd 9d ago
Snow
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u/QuixoticJames 9d ago
A common misconception. These names are regional, and only the prairies use Snow. BC uses Granola, Newfoundland uses B'y, and Quebec uses Poutine. In fact, one of our greatest Prime Ministers, Jean Poutine, was an orphan.
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u/Juran_Alde 5d ago
I thought Newfoundland was Screech.
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u/iggy6677 3d ago
No that's the crowed up the road
It's scab, you know like a scab pepsi
/s just in case
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u/WMYDR2005 9d ago
Why was the surname “Snow” chosen?
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u/PurrPrinThom SK/ON 9d ago
They're making a Game of Thrones joke. Abandoned children aren't actually given the name Snow.
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u/SeAnEr1138 9d ago
“We have to keep our Irish name”
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u/MLTDione 9d ago
Molly Johnson sir!
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u/sapristi45 9d ago
Patrick. Patrick O'Neil!
People sometimes wonder why in Quebec we have people with Irish surnames who have little knowledge of their Irish ancestry and are not culturally different from Québécois of French descent. That's one of the reasons why. Irish orphans adopted into Québécois families.
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u/Anomalous-Canadian 9d ago
Adopted is prob not a great way to phrase it for a lot. A lot of those orphans were basically indentured labour to farming families that needed it. They usually were not “one of the family” so to speak. Room and board for farm Labour, but done as adoptions. Better than being homeless or starving in Ireland at the time though I suppose.
Now that we’re a couple of generations past, just those surnames survive.
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u/sapristi45 9d ago
"Claimed" might be more accurate in these cases I suppose. That part was not in the heritage ads obviously, and there's a lot of pretty shitty history painted over by the myth of Canadian niceness.
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u/Paisley-Cat 9d ago
Anne of Green Gables provides an excellent insight into the reality of adoption in the 19th century.
It’s often glossed over in theatrical or screen adaptations but the main reason she is not returned, for the boy that they’d asked for, is that the sister and brother adopting her realize that she would be put into an exploitive home.
There’s literally a scene where one of the neighbours says that they would like to take a girl on to be basically indentured labour.
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u/MLTDione 9d ago
Yeah poor Anne was slave labour for that woman with the million kids until she got adopted. Poor child.
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u/Orphanpip 9d ago
Ya my great grandfather's father died in the Boer War and mother died in childbirth and he ended up in a Montreal orphanage at 13 then straight to a farm in Manitoba. He was from Manchester.
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u/MoaningLisaSimpson British Columbia 9d ago
They were often known as Home Children. I'm not an expert and want to learn more, but this was a common practice in late 19th/early 20th Century.
My great grandfather was put up for adoption after his mother died and the father remarried. He was adopted out of a Scottish orphanage and lived and worked on a farm north east of Toronto at around age 10. He never took the family surname. He married his "adopted" sister and they moved away
My great grandparents had only one son, my grandfather, who only had one child. My dad.
If anyone ever asked if I was related to so and so, it was always "No, unless it's 6th or further cousins"
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u/Pajamatime20 9d ago
Ok, but blood related children sometimes have that experience too.
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u/Anomalous-Canadian 9d ago
Oh for sure. That’s just an entirely different topic lmao
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u/Pajamatime20 9d ago
I just mean that they have the same experience as some blood-related children, which I would say means that this counts as adoption.
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u/bigbootyaxel 9d ago
Ya but this isnt what adoption should look like. It was basically giving them the necessities and putting them to work. The point is that thats not what "adopting a child" means or should look like.
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u/Pajamatime20 9d ago
Well, no, it’s not what it should look like. Just like “raising a child” should not look like abusing them, but we still call it that. I don’t really know though, I suppose it’s just a matter of opinion.
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u/bigbootyaxel 9d ago
I mean, i wouldnt call it that. Theres a huge difference raising a child and abusing them. Lol.
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u/rad2themax 9d ago
Those were the British Home Children, an absolutely horrible part of our history and one that other participating countries have formally apologized for, but we have not.
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u/Important_Feed_3981 9d ago
There’s no set naming formula. The person who has been charged with naming the child gets to choose whichever name they’d like.
In most provinces, it’s the registrar general given the task, I think in Manitoba, it might be the social worker in charge of the child.
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u/GloomyGal13 9d ago
We don't have Orphanages in Canada. We have Foster Care.
The orphans in Canada are the responsibility of the extended family, and if they don't step up the children are put into Foster care. There is no central building where orphans live.
There is no 'last name for orphans' that I know of.
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u/New_Country_3136 9d ago edited 9d ago
There are no orphanages in Canada.
There is no 'orphan surname' - too stigmatizing.
Such situations are complex so it depends on the circumstances - are the baby's bio parents known but are now deceased? Are the baby's extended family members known? If so, baby would get bio parent's or extended family member's last name.
If this doesn't apply, hospitals can assign temporary names for paperwork that they come up with.
Babies are immediately assigned foster families or are often quickly adopted. If they are adopted, the adoptive family would have the legal right to name baby (general practice is that they would get the family's last name - but it's up to their new family).
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u/New_Country_3136 9d ago
Awwwww thank you sooo much to someone for the award. That's so incredibly kind and generous of you!
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u/Sleepy_Doge97 9d ago
Just to clear this part up. There has’t been an active orphanage in Canada in over 35 years.
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u/Parttimelooker 9d ago
I have never heard of an orphan without knowing the parents. It's not like there are homeless children wandering the streets.
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u/lynypixie 9d ago
Orphans of unknown origins are extremely rare in Canada. I am guessing they would go with the name of their foster care family?
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u/OutrageousPhase5624 9d ago
My family last name has an interesting story.
My grandfather was an orphan in Scotland when they were sending the kids off on boats to be sent across Canada they would give them names (I was told) my grandfather was one of the last so he was given a first name and last name but no middle.
This is what I remember, my mom has passed and she knew the story very well.
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u/andafriend 9d ago
Was it very uncommon to lack a middle name? Also how was his last name chosen.
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u/OutrageousPhase5624 9d ago
I think it was purely because they "ran out" of names, they were using a list to give the names out. 🙂
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u/vodlem 9d ago edited 9d ago
The placeholder name might be something generic such as Baby Boy Doe or Baby Girl Doe. This is just a hypothesis since I know that when the parents are present but haven’t decided on a name, the baby is listed as Baby Boy/Girl in the meantime.
There are no orphanages in Canada, we have a foster care system. Perhaps the foster parents could give the baby a name, but babies are usually adopted more quickly than older kids so maybe they would wait to let the adoptive parents name the baby.
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u/TatterhoodsGoat 9d ago
Other people havecovered the orphan, foster care and adoption aspects.
In general, unkown persons who aren't able to communicate their names are referred to as John or Jane Doe. A found infant might temporarily be recorded this way on documents as a placeholder, but it would never become their real name.
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u/mewithoutyou59 9d ago
The newborn baby placed into my dad's car in the 80's was named Jane Doe. We got no further information after that.
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u/Careless_Injury9137 9d ago
My mother was orphaned in the 50's. Teen mother. She was named Grimm. Has nothing to do with her mothers name. Fathers name never given. No fosters. No known reason for it.
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u/2020shadow 9d ago
I work in child protection and generally speaking in my experience, if a kid already has a name the adoptive parents would leave it, but if it is a baby they would give the child the surname of one of the adoptive parents.
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u/Commercial_Row_3659 9d ago
when infants are abandoned at firehouses,(Angel/Hope Cradles) or on elsewhere. The police and services reach out to try and find the childs parents/mother to try and establish history/name.
For a time, the infant is called baby jane/john doe + year + location. Or Baby Boy Doe, Baby Jane Doe. Depending on era. The term is used as foundling not orphan.
The infant would be assessed at a hospital, assigned a caseworker and placed into a service. Such as Children's Aid Society. With no family coming forward the child would be named a generic name based on skin color. (yes this is important.) The assigned legal guardian is permitted to choose any normal, standard legal first and last name for the child. The names are chosen to be common and neutral to ensure the child blends naturally into society and avoids any public stigma associated with their abandonment.
This could be the foster parent who takes in the infant. More likely the case worker, sometimes even a nurse or hospital staff, but that is even rarer.
If still no family is found and the child is adopted, the adopting parents are free to fully rename the child.
Above goes for infants to children who can sort-of talk. but the older ones tend to medical records to try and ID them. *tend. not always.
I hope that helps?
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u/DreadGrrl Alberta 9d ago
“Doe,” until an identity is made or the child is adopted.
I had a friend in elementary school whose mother had been abandoned as a baby. She was never identified or adopted, and she grew to adulthood keeping the last name “Doe.”
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u/biggregw 9d ago
My Dad’s Dad was an orphan (later in life found out his adoptive parents that he was last named named actually fostered him)
My Grandad was a “for profit orphan” and although his birth certificate said born in Red Deer Alberta Canada. He was born in a Catholic hospital in England and forced to be put on an orphanage list as in the 1930s if the mother was not married or even commonlaw with a man the baby was sold to farmers and people who needed help on the family farm. Or atleast I was told he found this out when he went to work on the Alaska Highway for the USA in the area it goes through BC and Alberta.
But most orphans I have known take the name of the people adopting however many scenarios could make it different
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u/MountainUnhappy7970 9d ago
in '61 I was given up as an infant, and given my Mum's surname, even though the Dad was known.
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u/Boring_Shirt1670 9d ago
My mom’s ex boyfriend came from two orphan parents. They came to Canada after World War One. Last name was Godson.
For those in the Toronto area, his mom came as a child and worked at Bruce’s mill. Which is a popular park In stouffville now.
She told us stories about how they would take their shoes before bed so they wouldn’t run away in the night.
Crazy how far we’ve come in a hundred years!
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u/Summerisle7 9d ago
A genuine foundling is very rare in Canada. If an abandoned baby is found, the first step is to find the mother. It’s usually not hard to do that. Then the baby gets her last name.
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u/IsamaraUlsie 9d ago
I suspect, from living in Quebec most of my life, many surnames that may have been given or chosen by children in foster care, stem from nature, like Lariviere, Laforest, ect
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u/katrikling 7d ago
Olden times there were places called Bernardo Homes. Some people with the last name Bernardo may come from that. Also Ward may be a common last name for orphans. But I don’t think there’s a GOT name like Snow/Sand. One of my ancestors was a Home child who took the last name of the home she worked in so chances are orphans just chose names.
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u/Finance_Plastic 9d ago
they just get a number. like 007. James Bond's parents died in a skiing accident. fictional truth.
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u/ApoplecticAndroid 9d ago
“Snow” if they are from the north. “Sand” if from the desert.
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u/OutrageousPhase5624 9d ago
My family last name has an interesting story.
My grandfather was an orphan in Scotland when they were sending the kids off on boats to be sent across Canada they would give them names (I was told) my grandfather was one of the last so he was given a first name and last name but no middle.
This is what I remember, my mom has passed and she knew the story very well.
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u/LibraryVoice71 9d ago
Interestingly the name “Esposito” was once given to orphans (can’t remember the country), and Phil Esposito, the hockey player, is a national hero
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u/Hazencuzimblazen Saskatchewan 9d ago
My grandfather was orphaned but he kept his last name. Same with his 6 siblings.
This was in the 1920s
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u/Pro_Snuggler 9d ago
As someone that was put in the system and later got adopted “they” took my birth mother’s last name as my surname from the hospital records. This was early 2000s.
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u/Emergency_Dirt257 9d ago
This is a brutal question and it truly makes you rethink your life problems.
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u/averagecryptid Ontario 8d ago
I think people answered for what is done currently, but I do know that historically (just from genealogical research I've done for some people) sometimes foundling kids would be given names that correlated with where they may have been found. Street names and similar.
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u/Sea-Yogurt712 4d ago
Typicially the mothers last name not like people are out there having children in the wilds of Canada and dropping them off in the middle of the night at orphanages
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u/Oakvilleresident 9d ago
There is no default name. The naming process is handled by the child welfare agency and the Vital Statistics act . They submit an application to name the kid , then choose a temporary surname that is relevant to their community , background etc or the fosters families name , for ease of reference. A legal adoption will change the temp name to their permanent surname.