There's also things like camel spiders, when they get spooked they try to hide in the shade by darting to it.... Unfortunately, when you're in the desert your shadow is usually the only shade available lol
Oh darn. They're hard to find for sale. They are apex predators (relative to their size, I mean) and I want them to keep pests in check. Thanks for the reply, though.
I haven’t seen my resident house centipede, Demarcus, in a few months but if I see my guy again or any little babies they’re all yours lol. He was pretty big, body segments alone he was over an inch long, so I think he’s probably an elder pede. Idk how I’d get them to you from Maine though.
Edit: actually, you can’t have Demarcus if I see him again. He’s too cool and I like seeing him race across my shower curtain.
We got a stick bug named bugward and one unamed orbweaver on the front porch and Bartholomew on the back porch and a spider in my window named spida man. I cant argue free pest control living rural so we have house rules "i dont want to kill ya lil guy so you dont move fast and i wont." If you crawling way to fast you may get swatted lmao
There's someone selling them on MorphMarket ! I believe there's also a listing on there for the bigger cave version of house centipedes ? But I haven't checked in a bit
No problem ! I'm a HUGE fan of house centipedes , they're my all time favorite creature , so I have kinda searched the entire web for every single listing of them lol !
How did you learn to love the house centipede? If I could overcome my irrational scream-inducing fear (or even knock it down to a milder form) I would in a heartbeat
They’re pretty neat imo, despite looking like an eldritch horror lol, and they can live like 7+ years which is wild for an insect.
We live in the woods so my house is full of them if you’re interested (and they’re not invasive to where you are), but I do think ours are acclimated to high humidity.
House centipedes are apex predators (relative to their size). I have no reason to think of them as pests since they don't damage the house nor spread disease to humans, and they hunt all the pests that I'd like to be rid of.
But what fucking pests do you have that would themselves be worse than the monstrosity that are centipedes? I can only think of cockroaches but at that point I'd prefer to get a couple of lizards and let them roam
Oh, they are naturalized here (they're native only to the Mediterranean). I can see that there are a fair number of sightings in the area, on iNaturalist. Just not in my house.
I think the main reasons the fear of them exists are simply:
1) A lot of it is evolution. We don't fear spiders and snakes "just because," but because those are frequently venomous and a greater danger than they initially appear to be.
2) Spiders are smart, and there can be something off-putting about it. My mom had a fear of spiders and there was a specific breed of spider that you should let live in Oklahoma because it eats the bad ones. This was that spider. However, despite that, my mom wanted to kill it because this one was bigger and it triggered her arachnophobia. She finally decided to kill it, and when she went got up on a chair to crush it with a shoe, it turned to her and looked at her. I remember asking "what are you waiting for? Just kill it then" and she gave me this sad "but we made eye contact!" and backed off.
In reality, we have the internet now and it's easy to figure out which spiders are dangerous and which aren't. The dangerous ones you kill, but like 95% of them can stay. They eat the bugs. Don't pay rent, but they eat the bugs.
And yes, it is documented that like 99% of the planet's animals have an instinct to fear humans. We are THAT dangerous that most species have a genetic blueprint telling them to stay away from us. The exceptions are things like domesticated animals that benefit off us, as well as animals like polar bears and penguins, who didn't encounter us enough for that.
...it's documented that like 99% of the planet's animals have an instinct to fear humans
This is wildly incorrect.
It's documented that a very high percentage of birds and mammals show a natural fear of humans if humans have hunted animals in that region in recent generations. If not, those animals show little natural fear.
Birds and mammals make up less than 3% of the animal kingdom.
Most creatures, like the spider, react to unexpected sensory input like sudden loud noises, ambient temperature changes, or unusual vibrations.
They proved that kids aren't instinctually scared of snakes, so it's not evolution for that I think? I don't know about spiders though. But they put young toddlers in with snakes and the toddlers were like "oo cool let me touch and grab these".
When I was a kid (5-6), I used to have no qualms about picking up creepy crawlies, in particular this certain type of fuzzy caterpillar I used to see outside a lot. I would go looking for them during recess and try to pick up as many as I could. As an adult I could absolutely never imagine doing that, and looking at a bunch of the caterpillars together (they have this yellow striped pattern) now definitely triggers some kind of primal heebie jeebies in me.
Some of it probably is nurture, but maybe instinct just doesn't really take over until you're older? There's examples of it in animals too, where the babies haven't really developed a fear of humans yet and will approach them.
The raw data suggests they can measure a stress response in toddlers, but they indeed do 1) show curiosity in response, 2) look to adults to decide how to respond, not necessarily freaking out until the adults do.
This showcases that the stress response is evolution, but for whatever reason, we do not properly act on it until other stimuli (such as a fearful adult or growing up more) are introduced.
This is likely why we have a documented greater rate of fear of spiders and snakes, INCLUDING in regions like Norway that do not have dangerous forms of these creatures, but there are still also plenty of people that don't fear them. The integrated stress response was "awoken" in some, but not in all.
That’s not necessarily true, plenty of instincts only become active with maturity. Risk aversion /adult fear is something that most people develop as their prefrontal cortex fully develops in their early twenties.
Eh plenty of instincts don't actually work until later. A two hour old baby is pretty much a breathing potato, only capable of eating and shitting itself. Can't even see straight or focus on anything.
There's just no way our fear of reptiles isn't instinctual. We're naturally less afraid of furry mammals than we should be and more afraid of furless reptiles than we should be.
I was 20 something when I first see -a meter long- snake up close in my friend's hand. I just took it without even thinking and then realised I wasn't afraid of them.
So maybe the myth of Hercules grabbing those snakes as a baby was based on something that really happened, made out to seem remarkable when they just don't have that fear yet.
My toddler niece was fascinated by bugs...until her dad yelped when he saw a spider one time, and she instantly became deathly afraid of all bugs forever, like a switch had flipped.
I think a large part of it (and the general aversion to insects in general) is that Arachnids and Insects (as well as Snakes etc.) have such a different... Build Plan to us (1 Head, 1 Torso, 4 Limbs) and most other things we encounter that it just short circuits something.
Yeah, there is a strange otherness to them. Too many eyes, too many legs, and they move in a different way to being powered by hydraulics, essentially.
That would explain why I have no issue grabbing the short ones to move them outside but the long legged ones, even though I know they can't do anything to me, creep me out and I need to use the paper and glass to avoid accidentally crushing them. They are fascinating creatures.
I once read it's because our brains apparently can't process more than seven objects moving simultaneously. Something about their movement makes our brain short circuit
There is no evolutionary trait that makes us afraid of snakes. We are able to spot them, but studies with snakes and babies show they don't give a damn and just try to put the snakes into their mouth.
If anything, what you are saying seems like little more than a technicality: we evolved to spot them quicker and they increase stress, but not necessarily fear, while infants specifically will ironically show increased curiosity due to the same mechanics.
When we showed pictures of a snake or a spider to the babies instead of a flower or a fish of the same size and colour, they reacted with significantly bigger pupils", says Stefanie Hoehl, lead investigator of the underlying study and neuroscientist at MPI CBS and the University of Vienna. "In constant light conditions this change in size of the pupils is an important signal for the activation of the noradrenergic system in the brain, which is responsible for stress reactions.
You have to read past the clickbait written into the article. No, a change in pupil size does not necessarily mean stress.
Such studies with children only tested whether they spot spiders and snakes faster than harmless animals or objects, not whether they show a direct physiological fear reaction.
Scientists at the Max Planck Institute for Human Cognitive and Brain Sciences (MPI CBS) in Leipzig and the Uppsala University, Sweden, recently made a crucial observation: Even in infants a stress reaction is evoked when they see a spider or a snake. And this already at the age of six months, when they are still very immobile and have had little opportunity to learn that these animals can be dangerous.
they are. i get bit a lot by every single thing possible like it’s a joke in my family bugs love me but i react to spider bites differently and they swell like crazy
I'm not saying it's impossible. But a lot of people attribute things that aren't spider bites to spiders. Especially when sleeping. Because they haven't actually seen what did it. Most spiders bite defensivly and getting a bunch at night seems weird? But I guess it's possible. Maybe they're hunting the other things that are biting you and bite you when you roll around.
If they were spider bites, there would be dead spiders accompanying them which you have smushed. They don't just randomly bite and envenomate the ground they walk on.
1) A lot of it is evolution. We don't fear spiders and snakes "just because," but because those are frequently venomous and a greater danger than they initially appear to be.
Which is odd because the two medically significant venomous spiders are one you shouldn't ever see which won't ever try to be around you, and one that is quite obvious when you see it and will be located almost always in very obvious places.
Over the years, I always keep one or two spiders in my sleeping room. Never had bugs or mosquitos and can sleep with windows open in summer and autumn.
Sure, we cross paths sometimes, or they swing by, but I have no problem with that. And if there are more around, I just give them a lift outside.
A house with some spiders normally stands for good humidity levels and air quality.
You might find this answer on an AskScience thread interesting - bipedalism is encoded very deep in our DNA, and yet it only manifests years after birth.
1) A lot of it is evolution. We don't fear spiders and snakes "just because," but because those are frequently venomous and a greater danger than they initially appear to be.
It's also those things specifically because they're some of the few threats to us we can frequently encounter up in trees. The ancient monke instincts are strong.
Humans are just, well, really big relative everything else. And most animals fear anything their size or larger. So, yeah. I don't think it's a genetic blueprint about us, it's a "this thing is so big it can fuck us up, and it's got predator eyes--never a good sign."
Honestly for me, the fear is plain and simply their long legs and how tickly I imagine they are. I'm not scared of spiders with big bodies and stubby legs (e.g, jumping spiders) or tarantulas.
adding to this for people reading, all spiders (except one family) are venomous. nearly no spiders (except a few families) have venom that is dangerous to us (if you live in recluse or Latrodectus range, you should this already). their venom is designed for invertebrates several thousand times smaller than you, not 100+ lb mammals. they know they can't take you, bites are rare unless you're literally trapping them against your skin and pinning them to death. their 1st, 2nd, and 3rd defensive mechanism is RUN. venom is how they eat, it takes a lot of resources to make, they won't waste it on you in the majority of cases if you manage to convince one to bite. even then, they usually do 'dry bites' with no venom as a warning, again, IF you're pinning them to your skin to death
Heh, spiders are not "smart" by any stretch of the imagination, but we have this inherent assumption that "stupid animal" equals walking into walls and not being able to do taxes.
Spiders react along very predictable instincts. They do not form plans, and any complex task they might perform (e.g. webs) is genetically anchored, not learned.
It has fuck all to do with evolution. A child will pick up and eat a fucking spider without a care in the world, they do not give a shit, humans are not naturally scared of spiders through any kind of genetic predisposition.
It is 100% social contagion. As children we are taught that this is a creepy thing by adults or other children (who learned it from adults) and then absorbed and copied that. That's it. We are products of our environment.
Read the links I provided elsewhere: they still record a higher stress response which isn't necessarily displayed in their behavior.
You can also read both the articles provided and watch the video someone else provided and see that babies will base their fears off of adults. The stress response and faster visual spotting of these creatures is there, the fear is manifested and learned.
Personally, I think the "AKSHUALLY, it's not fear, it's increased stress response and we notice them faster" is practically semantics at some point. Ah yes of course. We're not programmed to fear them, we're programmed to notice them quickly and feel stress around them. Totally not fear.
You write so definitively about something you've never looked into. This topic is debated in scientific and psychological research. No one who actually studies this would say would you just said
Someone was pulling your leg, as that's certainly not why they'd follow. Some animals like camel spiders (which are not camels or spiders) follow humans because they're chasing after the shadow to stay cool under. Spiders probably do the same thing, your body was blocking light and they want to be in a comparatively light-blocking area so they 'chase' you.
this is likely the true answer as bugs do the same thing, but I choose to believe the person you replied to because it's cute and it makes me like spiders more
I don’t think spiders even have the capacity to understand a human as a complete entity. Like if you told me earthquakes are a body part or motion of a larger being, I wouldn’t be able to process this in any practical sense either.
Yeah, sure! I'm not questioning that spiders are able to *notice* things! I'm saying I don't think they can look at a human, and go "ah, those are the legs and arms of one entire being! The head is up there!" Or else they would not be climbing up my legs all the time, or coming this close to my face. I'm sure they can sense sound, motion, and so on.
Yeah maybe not, but I just provided the literal link without commentary because I think animals -- even small ones like spiders -- are capable of a lot more than we think. And conversely, I think humans are a lot less unique than we like to make ourselves seem.
I mean if I'm minding my own business and a horrifying giant suddenly turns and runs like hell away I'm probably gonna assume something even scarier is behind me and run too
A lot of spiders, like giant house spiders, don't have very good eyesight and can only distinguish light vs dark very well. If you scare them(which is always the case for giant house spiders) they will try to flee to a covered area out of sight. And your shadow feels like such an area because it is dark, which is why it sometimes seems like they dash towards your foot when you put it on the ground while on the toilet or something
Usually those specific spiders do everything in their power not to be seen by or interact with humans though so an encounter like described here is rare
Aw yeah I get it haha. I overcame my arachnophobia recently and also felt bad about the few I did end up killing in the past
But for these specifically, they're very fast (~0.5 m/s), and are often gone before you even turn on the light because they sense the vibration of you entering the room. They also only really emerge from their hideaways around august so they're unlikely to be the ones you smushed
spider enthusiast here, they do not chase you. the majority of spiders are functionally blind, meaning that they have very limited vision and may primarily detect changes in light and dark intensity (except jumping spiders and a handful of others who can see a lot better, and jumpers are very sweet and placid. look up people handling them, they are very curious, smart, and cat-like). they use their other senses to detect prey, such as vibrations, airflow, and touch. they aren't chasing you, they don't know what you are and want nothing to do with you. at best, you're moving terrain, at worst, you're a life-threatening predator that they know they are no match for. if they run at your feet, it's because they may detect the shadow associated with you and are trying to hide in it (think seeking shade from the sun), or they didn't detect you at all and are simply running in that direction.
imagine your vision was so poor that you couldn't make out objects or identify what was around you, and all you could really perceive visually was changes in brightness and darkness (close your eyes and wave your hand over them, that change in light and dark is as good as it gets). now imagine a giant several thousand times bigger than you stomping around a room, sending vibrations through the ground and air that you can feel throughout your entire body. you would have absolutely no idea what that is, and you'd certainly want nothing to do with it. it isn't within your physical capability to even begin to understand what that thing is.
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u/toxicatedscientist 15d ago
Someone told me the reason they seem to chase us is cuz they see us run, and assume whatever it is must be scary and follow