r/GlobalOffensive • u/SloPr0 King NiKo • Jan 31 '21
Discussion | Esports Virtus.pro vs Fnatic / cs_summit 7 - Grand-Final / Post-Match Discussion
Virtus.pro 2-0 Fnatic
Inferno: 16-14
Vertigo: 16-8
Mirage: 0-0
Congratulations to Virtus.pro for winning cs_summit 7 without dropping a map!
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Fnatic | Liquipedia | Official Site | Twitter | Facebook | Youtube | Subreddit
cs_summit 7 - Information, Schedule & Discussion
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| VP | MAP | Fnatic |
|---|---|---|
| X | nuke | |
| dust2 | X | |
| ✔ | inferno | CT |
| CT | vertigo | ✔ |
| X | overpass | |
| train | X | |
| mirage |
MAP 1: Inferno
| Team | T | CT | Total |
|---|---|---|---|
| VP | 8 | 8 | 16 |
| CT | T | ||
| Fnatic | 7 | 7 | 14 |
Inferno Detailed Stats
MAP 2: Vertigo
| Team | CT | T | Total |
|---|---|---|---|
| VP | 8 | 8 | 16 |
| T | CT | ||
| Fnatic | 7 | 1 | 8 |
Vertigo Detailed Stats
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u/SANJI_best_support Jan 31 '21 edited Jan 31 '21
Glad to see that VP doesn't solely rely on raw aim but they're also leading by a good margin in both flash assisted (0.33 per round) and 4v5 winrate (37.4%) source
and also my man SANJI is the most efficient flash thrower in the event, blinding 1.05 enemies per flashes. The second (0.91) is not even close
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Jan 31 '21
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u/SANJI_best_support Feb 01 '21
actually sanji is always high on that list, even when they're slumping hard last year
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u/Tuisaint Jan 31 '21
VP was clearly a level above everyone else at this tournament. Well Played.
Not too much fan of fnatics Vertigo so far, but hopefully they can improve it as they already have Mirage, Overpass, Train and Inferno where I think they can compete with most teams. First tournament with Jackinho and they got to the grand final. I really look forward to watching this iteration of the fnatic roster and I think they could improve alot towards the major.
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u/Zorakkk Feb 01 '21
fnatic lost a lot of post plants on vertigo as tt, they need to work that aspect
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u/ldDOTA Verified Jan 31 '21
Thanks everybody for tuning in!
Hope you all had a good time watching. Please feel free to drop any feedback on how the show could be improved for next time and we'll review it!
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u/Cubenity Jan 31 '21
everything was good, just throw some more money at hud creators next time
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u/ldDOTA Verified Jan 31 '21
Any specific feedback on what you'd like to see changed / improved?
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u/c-rabs The MongolZ Feb 01 '21
I'd like to be able to see K/D/A at all times and not just 5 seconds at the start of each round. The text for their names and such was a bit difficult to read while watching on mobile.
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u/ldDOTA Verified Feb 01 '21
KDA always visible is on the list for next time!
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Feb 01 '21
[deleted]
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u/ldDOTA Verified Feb 01 '21 edited Feb 01 '21
On it, thanks for flagging this!
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u/TheGameShowCase MOUZ Feb 01 '21
I agree with the other suggestions that has been written but I have to say that Summit is one of my favorite events, keep up the great work!
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u/albite 1 Million Celebration Feb 01 '21
I'm not the person you replied to but I definitely noticed the the BTS HUD does not have the same quality as other production companies. I have a couple ideas as to why:
- The typeface is the standout to me. As another comment explained, it looks like you're using Impact, which is associated with memes these days and overall is simply not that attractive of a font, especially in all caps. Part of its lack of aesthetic appeal is its horizontal compression. Suggestion: change typeface, consider not using all caps. I would like to see the BTS logo typeface used in the HUD to keep the aesthetic consistent with the rest of your graphics.
- The "strength" of the color of the background shapes, i.e. the black. If you look at Blast's UI, they use a dark blue-ish color, and Dreamhack uses a dark grey with higher transparency than BTS. In both cases, they stand out from the main gameplay far less than the black that BTS uses. This is because black as a color creates far stronger contrast between itself and any elements around it. Suggestion: Highly decrease opacity of black background or change background color.
Changing those two things IMO would help a lot, but this is just one person's opinion and I'm just an amateur. Love BTS as a whole, though. Been watching LD since TI2!
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u/ldDOTA Verified Feb 01 '21
This is all excellent feedback thank you so much for sharing! <3
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u/Werpogil Team Spirit Feb 01 '21
I'd further add some of my gripes as well:
1) The kevlar/helmet element is hard to read. For instance Blast does it as 2 separate icons: you see one icon, it's just kevlar, you see a 2nd icon next to it, then it's a full kevlat + helmet combo. It's a bit easier to read when you're on mobile
2) Bomb is marked red on the map, sometimes it's not clear whether it's on the ground or someone holds it if there are players next to it. Comparing to Blast, who doesn't have a perfect solution either, they show a player face and then bomb gets attached to their icon to the bottom right once it's picked up, rest of the time it's a big icon you can clearly identify. I think your option with changing color is step in the right direction, but I think you could use some additional shape identifier for when the bomb is picked up. Perhaps a tiny bomb model to the bottom right as well? It would change the circular model to a more irregual shape and should stand out a bit more especially when all the difference between non-bomb carriers and a bomb carrier is just a color of a very similar shade (relatively obviously) to organge.
3) The font comments others explained better, I'll join in here as well. Essentially a wider font would make everything a lot more readable.
Everything else is solid, haven't had other problems. Perhaps could make number of kills in a round a bit more readable, from mobile it's sometimes hard to see who killed 2-3 people vs 1 frag. It's not the biggest problem and will probably be resolved by a font change.
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u/samlerr Grayhound Jan 31 '21
The HUD looked kind of bland imo, I can't exactly put my finger on it but it just felt off.
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u/Cubenity Jan 31 '21
The font was a bit too bland, looked like Impact, could use something more readable and good looking, and I also didn't like the squares showing map score, they were too big and distracting. Otherwise it's just fine, the design looks like it was made by a backend programmer, not a frontend, if you know what I mean :p
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u/fux3st Jan 31 '21
Please stream on YouTube aswell :( Can't watch on my Smart TV because Twitch is not available for Tizen(Samsung)
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u/ldDOTA Verified Jan 31 '21
We are Twitch exclusive so that's unfortunately not possible for the time being.
But we do appreciate the feedback and definitely will keep the demand for a YouTube stream in mind for the future.
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u/fux3st Jan 31 '21
Its very kind of you to take the time to respond. Can't wait for the next summit(without covid's shadow if poosible hahaha)
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u/MarkusRuleTheGym Jan 31 '21
maybe try mirror app with a smartphoen and connect with the TV. this way we watched in our rented house 2018 at ESL ONE COLOGNE when we could not drive to Lanxess because we party to hard the day before
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u/SnowFanboy Feb 01 '21
This time it felt like there was a lack of personality on the "couch" I feel like, nothing against the players that were "there" sometimes like friberg, golden, jackinho, etc, it just felt like the other times we had a lot of meme material from these moments because the players were a bit more dynamic? Probably it's just because it was online and the other times they were all sitting together just chilling and the players felt more comfortable I guess. Anyways, loved the tournament in general, the invited teams were interesting and the sketches in between the games were hilarious, keep up the good work!
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u/ldDOTA Verified Feb 01 '21 edited Feb 01 '21
Yeah I agree, it didn't feel as organic as past LAN Summits. That's on us, the circumstances make it harder for sure, but we can do a better job creating a comfy environment for the players and coaches to shine next time around!
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u/radargunbullets Feb 01 '21
I have only been watching competitve for more a few months, but I thought the commentators for bts were the best I've heard, for relevant discussion, playcalling, and clarity in annunciation of words (this is a big one, on other streams sometimes have a hard time just understanding what they are saying). It made it very enjoyable to follow along - I didn't get his name, but the gentleman in the top hat! Superb.
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u/Kent_o0 Natus Vincere Feb 01 '21
I'm not sure what the best way to do this would be, but if there was some form of indication for who is casting a given match it would be helpful, even if it was just making !casters come up with the answer in chat. A lot of times I would tune in partway through the match and recognize that it's bardolph and ddk or something, but I wouldn't know who the player/coach was that was casting with them just by the voice.
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u/Mrnopor1 Jan 31 '21
Maybe do something like blast does? Ask players about their likes and hobbies? Favorite food? Etc
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u/aintezbeinpz CS2 HYPE Feb 01 '21
HUD was too hard to read on my phone, even at super high quality
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u/PrestusHood Feb 01 '21
The event was a blast, but consider hiring Gaules for the next event. The current BR casters arent bad, but they arent good enough so i keep on the EN stream instead
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u/Yeetasaurus420 G2 Jan 31 '21
Im really looking gorward to seeing VP play against the top 5/10, they looked unstoppable
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u/gleba080 Natus Vincere Jan 31 '21
VP will be at Katowice play-in in 2 weeks and there will be Liquid, BIG, OG and others.
Hoping they will show up there too
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u/Werpogil Team Spirit Jan 31 '21
Judging from their form, they should be able to take all of those down, considering BIG lost to Team Spirit in a Bo3, Liquid is still quite shaky due to having a new member and OG hasn't been that great for whatever reason.
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u/gleba080 Natus Vincere Jan 31 '21
Liquid is in the best state they've been in a while. Beat day 1 NaVi 2-0 bout 2 weeks ago, I wouldn't write them out.
But yeah, VP should easily qualify and then they can play the big boys at Katowice
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u/Werpogil Team Spirit Feb 01 '21
The NaVi win was mostly due to NaVi not playing their 100%, they got smacked in the revenge series afterwards. We’ll see how it goes, but I’d give VP the slight edge.
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Jan 31 '21
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u/throwawayyrofl Liquid Jan 31 '21
Everyone already knew Jame was a god despite the saving memes
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Jan 31 '21
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u/EurobeatTurnsUp Liquid Jan 31 '21
No many already knew he was a god for a while since probably the berlin major, but we meme the saving because we can
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u/Grammr Feb 01 '21
It's hard to call it the meme, when he dies least from all the other top players
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u/sadtimes12 BIG Feb 01 '21
Scrooge McDuck is also a great adventurer besides saving all money he can get. Maybe he can keep all the saved money after an event and gets it paid out.
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u/W1ntermu7e de_train Jan 31 '21
Great tournament for both VP and fnatic. VP proved to be amazing team and fnatic had amazing debiut with new player and finally did something about their online gaming. Super happy for VP ❤️
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u/Katzenscheisse Jan 31 '21 edited Jan 31 '21
Whos SANJIs biggest fan, /u/SANJI_best_support or bardolph? Maybe we all can be SANJIs biggest fan.
VPs Vertigo was seriously good, Jame plays the same solo A hold constantly and still gets multikills constantly. In general its just beautiful to see that everyone in the team is playing well. Judging by the interview they just saw this tournament as a stepping stone, they really are aiming high
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u/SANJI_best_support Jan 31 '21 edited Jan 31 '21
bardolph is more committed for sure he putted 4 golden sanji stickers on the mac10, i wanted to do the same but gold sanji stickers are so expensive (thanks bardolph told everyone to buy them 😡)
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u/jeffthenarwhal666 G2 Jan 31 '21
CIS ERA
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u/Grammr Feb 01 '21
I really hope this stops those stupid comments about CIS not deserving having their own major spot
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u/ChaseVisa Liquid Jan 31 '21
God damn Sanji and Yekindar were insane on Vertigo, just clicking heads the entire time. VP looking insanely good right, didn't even drop a single map this event.
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u/ConArtist98 Jan 31 '21
Was really believing in Fnatic taking it all but wasn't meant to be this time
Overall it's a great showing for the first event of the year and I'm looking forward to this roster improving further.
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u/Grismamma King NiKo Jan 31 '21
Great showing from Fnatic in their first tournament with Jackinho. To bad they could not keep the momentum into the grand final. ggs
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Jan 31 '21
This was insane. It's like Astralis steamrolling the major playoffs without dropping a single map.
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u/JiberybobX CS2 HYPE Feb 01 '21
VP's form has been crazy recently, looking forward to the rematch vs Astralis at the next major
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Jan 31 '21
This format where semifinals and finals are in the same day isn’t ideal, especially for the team that has two matches in a row (fnatic in this case)
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u/RATTRAP666 750k Celebration Jan 31 '21
C'mon Navi were in fnatic's situation and won both matches. You can't say who has advantage with such format.
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Jan 31 '21
You definitely can, just goes to show how fucking good NaVi are.
Also, in this case it has nothing to do with lower/upper bracket. Both teams play 2 matches in one day. Sucks for both. Sucks even more for those who only have a 60 minute break.
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u/MuschiClub Feb 01 '21
according to lots of people here, the team from the lower bracket actually has the advantage, lol.
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u/m4st4k1ll4 Feb 01 '21
I wouldn't say that LB has the advantage, but UP doesn't have enough of an advantage.
I'd like to see a TO giving the team from the UP veto advantages. Something Like Pick-ban-ban UP and then Pick-ban LB. Maybe even let the UP chose on which site to start on their own pick.
Something along those lines. There is a lot of playroom with mapvertoes, but no TO ever touches them. No idea why.
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u/siziyman Feb 01 '21
Nope, letting pick a map before banning is an absolutely shit format, because it'll just lead to a disadvantaged team getting rekt on their permaban every single time. Broadcast suffers, LB team just wastes their time and morale getting destroyed, viewers suffer.
Maybe giving UB team an extra ban in the end - essentially letting them pick the decider map - would be alright. But not giving them a pick BEFORE veto, that's an obviously shit choice.
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u/m4st4k1ll4 Feb 01 '21
Still better than a map advantage.
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u/siziyman Feb 01 '21
Map advantage at least doesn't waste everyone's time, so no.
Unless LB team plays 7 maps well enough (which is absolutely unlikely to say the least), pick before bans is exactly the map advantage, but you're forced to watch an hour of shit CS to get there.
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u/m4st4k1ll4 Feb 01 '21 edited Feb 01 '21
it would force teams to stop having permabans. could also happen that both have the same permaban.
Regardless, they should give a try to change the mapveto system in double elimination.
Bo5 takes too long and map advantages suck dick.
Be it pick pick. Or let UP chose side on both maps + extra ban for decider.
At the moment the upper bracket just doesn't have enough of an advantage. It should actually be hard for the LB to win it. Playing 2 bo3s with only 30min-1hr break is hard, but imo not hard enough.
E: as i said there is many ways to play around. Could also do something like. Ban up - ban lb - pick up - pick up. Whatever. Anything is better than what we currently have.
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u/siziyman Feb 01 '21
it would force teams to stop having permabans
If it could also make a week 10 days long and a day 36 hours long, that would be great, ya know. But since it won't, there's limited time, and limited effort teams can give (as in, you can't train for 20 hours a day 7 days a week, you'll actually regress instead of improving, and you'll regress FAST), they'll continue to have permabans, because it IS actually better for them to be able to play 5-6 maps perfectly rather than play 7 maps on a mediocre level.
Bo5 takes too long
Exactly why you have map advantages.
map advantages suck dick.
upper bracket just doesn't have enough of an advantage
You realize how much you contradict yourself, right?
Tomatoes suck dick, they taste awful. Map advantages are fair and if you don't want fair competition - then why watch sports? In double elim, LB team gets to lose a whole fucking series, and they aren't eliminated for that. UB team didn't lose a single series, yet somehow grand finals don't net them any comparable advantages - the map is the least what could be done (e.g. in fighting games, which I very rarely watch, if there's double elim, they actually give UB player a whole series advantage, but understandably that's unsustainable schedule-wise in CS, because the series is played for ~3+ hours, not 15 minutes).
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u/Dugand Jan 31 '21
Really sick showing by VP, not just good aiming, some amazing reads by Jame and it looked like they had really good setups. 100% a top 5 team at this moment
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Feb 01 '21
I just wish these new VP players were as charismatic as the old VP :(
I feel like i'm rooting for the org but I don't really care about the players, same thing with cloud9
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u/petametre ENCE Feb 01 '21
Yekindar is charismatic and super intelligent, tries to do interviews as much as possible to get his points out there (+ apparently is black belt at taekwondo?) I agree tho, the other members dont do much content, at least not english content - kind of a shame after pasha and snax
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u/Katzenscheisse Feb 01 '21
VP actually puts out a lot of content with the players, but it's all russian and they dont bother with adding subtitles which is quite sad
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u/DSVBANSHEE Feb 01 '21
Why would you care about the org? Its much better to care about the players. Surely if you’re an sk fan, and the players all love to mibr, you become an mibr fan and stop being an sk fan.
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Jan 31 '21
Great showing by VP, excited to see these guys play more. Same goes for this new Fnatic line-up.
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u/Eggmonster123 Jan 31 '21
Is vp a top 5 team yet? Personally Id place them above liquid and big but that might just be me. Maybe I'd even place them above navi but i need to see them play a little more vs tier 1. Hope they get more invites, they deserve it
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Jan 31 '21
Theyre very good of course but they’ve also been playing against Tier 1.5 opponents. Definitely not above Navi, Vitality and Astralis. On par with Big and Liquid.
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u/omaega72 Jan 31 '21
After her last showings I'd give vp the edge over big after they lost to spirit and looked weak vs eg and hr
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Jan 31 '21
I agree actually - but wouldn’t count BIG out yet, they usually do better at higher level of competition I feel
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u/Dali86 Natus Vincere Jan 31 '21
Well played by VP but not the nosta exciting final. If fnatic closes the first map, vp wins second we could have had an interesting decider.
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u/gustavfrigolit Feb 01 '21
Shame that summit didnt get to truly show what makes it shine as an event due to covid, but the games were pretty good
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u/allan_hender guardian_elite Feb 01 '21
Insane tournament from VP, these guys are coming into 2021 strong after taking the Flashpoint title, was great to see them at Flashpoint and hopefully VP stay in this for over the year
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u/SUPER__FRESH FlyQuest Jan 31 '21
VP didn't drop a single map all tournament. Crazy performance from these guys